# Population Genetics > Paleogenetics > Paleolithic & Mesolithic >  was E1b1b1b1-L19 the founding father of the Ibero-Maurisians?

## bicicleur

the Neolithic North African paper https://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2017/09/21/191569
has been discussed here : http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads...182#post520182

7 ka IAM has Y-DNA pré-E-M183, in the E-M81 branch descending from E-L19

studying the TMRCA's in the YFull tree Ted Kendall concludes that E-L19 is Ibero-Maurisian 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/yful...9420928087751/
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-M35/

E1b1b1b1-Z830 was identified amongst Natufian and both E1b1b1b1-Z830 and E1b1b1a1-M78 were identified in PPNB Ain Ghazal
E1b1b1b1-L19, the third branch would then have chosen another path and have arrived in Morocco

what is your opinion?

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## berun

I prefer the simplest option, that herders from Levant expanded to Africa with their Afroasiatic languages. The dates provided and the Y-DNA are in agreement, for autosomes I don't know, no time to check yet... 

Local mtDNA usually survive much or less after admixtures.

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## werner

I think E1b-L19 is a libyan (western) brunch of north egypt with small connect to the marocco population of E1a-M81 cluster (coastal fishing). And Nafturian is a other (eastern) brunch of north Egypt.

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