# Humanities & Anthropology > Philosophy >  Death

## ericrdpilot

Based on what little information I can find on the subject, and my own interpretations, I believe humans were less afraid of death thousands of years ago than they are now. I think part of it might have been religion based, the other part was they dealt with death on a regular basis. They were closer to the natural world and understood death better.

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## Ceribell

There are some that say, and I tend to agree that the root of all anxiety, phobia, OCD, mental disorders etc. stems from the fear of death. . . Thanatophobia. 
It could very well be that because we are so focused on ourselves we have become more afraid of dying then we might have been thousands of years ago.

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## ericrdpilot

Yes totally true.

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## bnuizqueb

There is such a moment that people used to live less, diseases, droughts, hunger, difficult climatic conditions! All this accompanied an already not very good standard of living! Therefore, they were rather afraid than not, I agree with you!

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## carmenfalkon

> There are some that say, and I tend to agree that the root of all anxiety, phobia, OCD, mental disorders etc. stems from the fear of death. . . Thanatophobia. 
> It could very well be that because we are so focused on ourselves we have become more afraid of dying then we might have been thousands of years ago.


I agree. it is inextricably linked to reflection

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## Ceribell

It is ironic how the older we get, the more accepting of our inevitable death we become. My own death is still the scariest thing that I can think of, that or even worse one of my children. Maybe for some people the aches and pains of old age, loneliness and despair become too much and death is a relief. . . the finish line. 
but then again I know plenty of people in their 80s and 90s that are healthy and vibrant and don’t seem fazed at all about dying.

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## Tamakore

> It is ironic how the older we get, the more accepting of our inevitable death we become. My own death is still the scariest thing that I can think of, that or even worse one of my children. Maybe for some people the aches and pains of old age, loneliness and despair become too much and death is a relief. . . the finish line. 
> but then again I know plenty of people in their 80s and 90s that are healthy and vibrant and don’t seem fazed at all about dying.


Surveys show that older people are generally happier about everything than middle aged people, and that probably includes being less anxious about death.

Before modern times parents might seem to shrug their shoulders even over the death of their own children because it was such an expected routine event. It was a rare family that was spared from some level of infant or child mortality. These days we expect our children to live, we expect to live to 80 ourselves and we now expect governments to be concerned with safety in the workplace, safe travel, etc., so in a sense we are more anxious about avoiding death than we used to be.

However, most animals have an inbuilt fear of life threatening situations, which leads them to try and escape predators, flee forest fires, avoid the edges of cliffs, etc. Fear of death is an evolutionary advantage for all animals, including us.

Humans, though, should surely only fear death if they believe they are going to hell because of their sins. For those who believe they are going to heaven, death should have no sting. That includes most "sinners" who are usually confident that God will forgive their sins, no matter who bad they were.

Atheists should not fear death either, because for them death is "mere oblivion" (as Shakespeare put it). After death there is no pain, no regrets, no anxiety, no awareness of anything past, present or future.

Perhaps wavering agnostics might fear death because maybe hell does exist and they haven't prayed for forgiveness or believed in God. Also, those gullible people who believe in ghosts might fear death as a possible transition to becoming an unhappy, restless spirit for all eternity.

I think many people fear the process of dying more than death itself. It can be painful, and knowing that death is near can be a time for regrets and sadness. On the other hand, many people die peacefully in their sleep at home with no warning, like my grandfather. It was a shock for my grandmother, but she heard him take his last breath and there was no movement, no sign of distress. He simply stopped breathing due to a heart attack. That's the way I'd like to go, and I see no point in worrying about when it will happen, as long as I've made some sensible preparations, such as writing a will.

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## Angela

> Surveys show that older people are generally happier about everything than middle aged people, and that probably includes being less anxious about death.
> 
> Before modern times parents might seem to shrug their shoulders even over the death of their own children because it was such an expected routine event. It was a rare family that was spared from some level of infant or child mortality. These days we expect our children to live, we expect to live to 80 ourselves and we now expect governments to be concerned with safety in the workplace, safe travel, etc., so in a sense we are more anxious about avoiding death than we used to be.
> 
> However, most animals have an inbuilt fear of life threatening situations, which leads them to try and escape predators, flee forest fires, avoid the edges of cliffs, etc. Fear of death is an evolutionary advantage for all animals, including us.
> 
> Humans, though, should surely only fear death if they believe they are going to hell because of their sins. For those who believe they are going to heaven, death should have no sting. That includes most "sinners" who are usually confident that God will forgive their sins, no matter who bad they were.
> 
> Atheists should not fear death either, because for them death is "mere oblivion" (as Shakespeare put it). After death there is no pain, no regrets, no anxiety, no awareness of anything past, present or future.
> ...


That's a very thoughtful response, but I don't see things quite the same way. 

Certainly, for people who are in chronic pain, or are very incapacitated, death can be a release. Until that happens, though, many people, even sincere believers in an afterlife strive very hard to stay alive. My mother was like that. She was what we call a daily communicant, and was firmly convinced that there was an afterlife where she was convinced she would eventually meet all her departed loved ones.

When she was diagnosed with a primary brain tumor at 61, she did everything she could to stay alive, undergoing two brain surgeries and the implantation of radioactive seeds in the tumor to try to stave off the inevitable. She was very clear about her reasons: she wasn't ready yet. She and my father had just started to travel extensively, there were no more money worries, and most importantly, she had four grandchildren she adored and she wanted to see them grow up more, especially seeing how many people lived into their 80s and had that opportunity. Most importantly, perhaps, she was worried about how my father would handle her passing; she was right about that, as he died barely nine months after her passing. As he said, he wanted to be with her. 

However, after the second surgery she was paralyzed along her entire left side and was bedridden. My father, my aunt and I took turns caring for her, but she became more and more depressed. This wasn't a life she wanted to prolong. No matter how much care my father took of her, making sure she never got a bedsore, reading to her, playing her music, cooking her favorite food, it was just too much. Not even he could make her fight it anymore. 

So, I don't think belief in an afterlife means you won't or shouldn't fear death.

Likewise, I guess I'm now a sort of agnostic. Even if there is a God, I don't believe in an afterlife. However, the idea of my personality, my memories, my loves, all disappearing into a void is more terrifying even than spending a couple of decades in limbo would ever be. 

I've seen "good" deaths where people "are" ready, and have no fear of the afterlife; my grandparents were like that. They were both in their late 80s, getting infirm, even their grandchildren were mostly all married, and they were just tired, I think. My father had a good death too; he was hoping for it because he firmly believed he'd be reunited with my mother, and she was by far the most important person in the world for him, the one person without whom he couldn't contemplate existence.

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## bigsnake49

I am totally reconciled with my eventual death. I am convinced that there is no afterlife, afterlife being a construct of religions to make believers behave in this life by promising them a reward/punishment in the afterlife. I know that for some people it is scary to think of themselves disappearing after their death but it is exactly what happens. I am sure that one's close family will miss them and preserve their memory but eventually their memory will fade. If one wrote scientific articles, then one's articles get quoted and referred but eventually even those will fade. For me, I derive satisfaction from the fact that I lived a good life, hurt nobody and helped a few to improve theirs. I am proud of what my kids have become. I have always wondered about what my life would have been like if certain critical decisions in my life were different.

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## Ceribell

> Surveys show that older people are generally happier about everything than middle aged people, and that probably includes being less anxious about death.
> 
> Before modern times parents might seem to shrug their shoulders even over the death of their own children because it was such an expected routine event. It was a rare family that was spared from some level of infant or child mortality. These days we expect our children to live, we expect to live to 80 ourselves and we now expect governments to be concerned with safety in the workplace, safe travel, etc., so in a sense we are more anxious about avoiding death than we used to be.
> 
> However, most animals have an inbuilt fear of life threatening situations, which leads them to try and escape predators, flee forest fires, avoid the edges of cliffs, etc. Fear of death is an evolutionary advantage for all animals, including us.
> 
> Humans, though, should surely only fear death if they believe they are going to hell because of their sins. For those who believe they are going to heaven, death should have no sting. That includes most "sinners" who are usually confident that God will forgive their sins, no matter who bad they were.
> 
> Atheists should not fear death either, because for them death is "mere oblivion" (as Shakespeare put it). After death there is no pain, no regrets, no anxiety, no awareness of anything past, present or future.
> ...


Yes, I do believe in an afterlife otherwise, what would point of our existence. Life would be meaningless.

It is the process of dying that scares me. Working in healthcare I see it all of the time, terminally ill patients being offered every type of medical treatment and given false hope. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer that has spread to her liver and lungs. She has three teenage children and just turned 50. She is fighting as hard as she can to beat the odds, but the chemotherapy is really taking a toll and her quality of life is declining. I feel so bad for my niece and nephews. I lost my dad when I was a teenager and not a day goes by when I don’t think about him. 
When you are old, I suppose that you grow to accept the inevitable, but isn’t it a kicker . . .you spend years working hard, building a life, for many still mentally sharp with loads of wisdom and experience only to be taken down in one sharp swoop by death.

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## Angela

> Yes, I do believe in an afterlife otherwise, what would point of our existence. Life would be meaningless.
> 
> It is the process of dying that scares me. Working in healthcare I see it all of the time, terminally ill patients being offered every type of medical treatment and given false hope. My sister-in-law has metastatic breast cancer that has spread to her liver and lungs. She has three teenage children and just turned 50. She is fighting as hard as she can to beat the odds, but the chemotherapy is really taking a toll and her quality of life is declining. I feel so bad for my niece and nephews. I lost my dad when I was a teenager and not a day goes by when I don’t think about him. 
> When you are old, I suppose that you grow to accept the inevitable, but isn’t it a kicker . . .you spend years working hard, building a life, for many still mentally sharp with loads of wisdom and experience only to be taken down in one sharp swoop by death.


I completely understand your point of view. One of the reasons I'm no longer a believer is precisely because I refuse to reconcile myself to the suffering and deaths of innocents. How could a loving God create a universe where something like this can happen to your sister-in-law and her three teenage children. It happened to my best friend when she was even younger, and had to leave behind an eight and a ten year old. 

Don't get me started on these experimental drug protocols that they con some people into trying. I've seen too much of that.

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## firetown

> Based on what little information I can find on the subject, and my own interpretations, I believe humans were less afraid of death thousands of years ago than they are now. I think part of it might have been religion based, the other part was they dealt with death on a regular basis. They were closer to the natural world and understood death better.


What are people more afraid of?
The state of death or the process of dying?
I would guess the latter has consistently remained the same.
I am assuming the state of death may resemble peace to some while others fear agony in hell.

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## Angela

I haven't feared hell since I was a child, and even then I didn't hear it for myself, but for my father, because except for weddings, baptisms and funerals he never set foot in a church. Not every Christian is taught the fire and brimstone version of eras past. For Catholics, at least, or so, at least, I was taught, hell is the absence of the presence of God, and we were not to presume to know who was there, given the infinite mercy and understanding of God.

I don't think anything I've done in my life would qualify me for hell even if it's there. 

No, what I fear the most is the oblivion, the nothingness, the fact that I will never be with my loved ones again. 

I will admit, however, that as someone whose sense of justice is integral to my identity and formed the basis of much of my life's work, the idea that evil, destructive people will never be punished does make me sometimes wish I believed in hell.

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## Tamakore

Even those who believe in a happy afterlife usually still do their best to avoid death, and may fight to stay alive when seriously ill. I think that might be because belief in an afterlife can co-exist with death realism, that is, the knowledge that death is the end of life as you know it. For both the deceased and the bereaved, death represents separation from loved ones. Some might believe in eventual reunification, but in the meantime there is the loss and separation.

Those like me who don't believe in an afterlife might regard death as more of a tragedy for the friends and family left behind than for the one who dies. However, I agree that contemplating the end of all my memories, awareness and feelings is a sad thought, so I would rather live forever than die at any point. Life expectancy has increased greatly over the past couple of centuries, and that trend may accelerate in the future, but not fast enough to change my belief in the inevitability of my own death. 

Anticipating death might be sad, but believing that after death I will have no awareness and no regrets is actually a comfort to me.

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## Angela

> *Even those who believe in a happy afterlife usually still do their best to avoid death, and may fight to stay alive when seriously ill. I think that might be because belief in an afterlife can co-exist with death realism, that is, the knowledge that death is the end of life as you know it. For both the deceased and the bereaved, death represents separation from loved ones. Some might believe in eventual reunification, but in the meantime there is the loss and separation.*
> 
> Those like me who don't believe in an afterlife might regard death as more of a tragedy for the friends and family left behind than for the one who dies. *However, I agree that contemplating the end of all my memories, awareness and feelings is a sad thought, so I would rather live forever than die at any point.* Life expectancy has increased greatly over the past couple of centuries, and that trend may accelerate in the future, but not fast enough to change my belief in the inevitability of my own death. 
> 
> Anticipating death might be sad, but believing that after death I will have no awareness and no regrets is actually a comfort to me.


Exactly how I see it except for the last sentence. :)

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## firetown

> No, what I fear the most is the oblivion, the nothingness, the fact that I will never be with my loved ones again.






> Anticipating death might be sad, but believing that after death I will have no awareness and no regrets is actually a comfort to me.


Maybe there will come a point where we are just tired and exhausted and ready to let go.

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## Angela

> Maybe there will come a point where we are just tired and exhausted and ready to let go.


I think that's very true. I have a lot of great aunts who reached their middle nineties, one grandmother her late eighties, and they were just too tired from forcing their bodies to keep on functioning when so many of their dear ones were already gone. 

I've also seen more people than I wish I had seen struggling with pain for long periods of time. Death was a blessed relief. 

One thing frightens me even more than a painful death from cancer, and that's any of the neurological diseases where your mind is clear but you're trapped in your immobile body. That, and Alzheimer's. If it were legal, I'd provide that if I have it, and I get to the point where I don't recognize my loved ones or know who I am, they just give me an overdose of heroin. 

Some things are worse than death.

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## Ceribell

> I completely understand your point of view. One of the reasons I'm no longer a believer is precisely because I refuse to reconcile myself to the suffering and deaths of innocents. How could a loving God create a universe where something like this can happen to your sister-in-law and her three teenage children. It happened to my best friend when she was even younger, and had to leave behind an eight and a ten year old. 
> 
> Don't get me started on these experimental drug protocols that they con some people into trying. I've seen too much of that.


I’m curious whether your belief in a higher power was something that gradually dissolved or if it disappeared quickly following a tragic event in your life. Personally, while my faith sometimes may waver, so far it has never died.
No doubt going to Catholic school for eight years ingrained itself into my mindset. When events in my life bring sorrow, going to church somehow makes me feel better, strengthens my faith and gives me hope that there is something more then our worldly existence.
Do you think that there is any truth at all to the Bible or is it just some ancient form of fake news?

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## firetown

> I’m curious whether your belief in a higher power was something that gradually dissolved or if it disappeared quickly following a tragic event in your life. Personally, while my faith sometimes may waver, so far it has never died.
> No doubt going to Catholic school for eight years ingrained itself into my mindset. When events in my life bring sorrow, going to church somehow makes me feel better, strengthens my faith and gives me hope that there is something more then our worldly existence.
> Do you think that there is any truth at all to the Bible or is it just some ancient form of fake news?


Our true self seeks connection. Why the need for religious interpretation?
The closer you are/get to your true self, the more you are likely to reject religious interpretations of real experiences.
But everyone is different:
Many seem pacified and okay with other people's fabrications.
Others are unable to live someone else's lies.

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## Angela

> I’m curious whether your belief in a higher power was something that gradually dissolved or if it disappeared quickly following a tragic event in your life. Personally, while my faith sometimes may waver, so far it has never died.
> No doubt going to Catholic school for eight years ingrained itself into my mindset. When events in my life bring sorrow, going to church somehow makes me feel better, strengthens my faith and gives me hope that there is something more then our worldly existence.
> Do you think that there is any truth at all to the Bible or is it just some ancient form of fake news?


It was a process which started because of my line of work, which forced me to see every day the kind of pain which people can impose on one another, and gradually morphed into a realization that even the perpetrators, although they had to be removed from society for the safety of others, might have been only partially responsible because many had social, and more importantly mental and psychological deficiencies or disorders which might have been an accident of genetics and life experiences.

During one decade of my life that combined with a series of terrible events affecting not only my family, but also close friends and, to some extent, me as well. 

I could not reconcile that with the existence of an omnipowerful, omnipresent, and loving God. Now, I recognize that some people accept the idea of a creative godhead but believe that once having created the world "God" left evolution and humanity to their own devices. I find that completely unsatisfying. So was the bromide my priest(s) gave me that it's a mystery and we can't presume to understand it. I eagerly picked up a copy of that bestseller, "Why do good people suffer", to which I would add, why do children suffer through no possible fault of their own, and there were no answers there either.

As I've said before, my sense of justice and fairness is an integral part of my nature. So is a belief in the intellect and power of human understanding, prideful though that may be. It is indeed a cliche, but also profoundly tragic, that the world is not fair. Furthermore, if God didn't want us to understand all of these things why give us an intellect at all?

So, faith comes into conflict with both of my "animating" characteristics, if you will.

I don't know if you've ever read any of Elie Wiesel's work. I don't presume to equate the suffering I've seen at close hand to the suffering people experienced during the Holocaust, or put my intellect on a par with his, but I recognize my feelings in his. He is irretrievably sundered from God even though he profoundly misses Him.

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## ihype02

> It was a process which started because of my line of work, which forced me to see every day the kind of pain which people can impose on one another, and gradually morphed into a realization that even the perpetrators, although they had to be removed from society for the safety of others, might have been only partially responsible because many had social, and more importantly mental and psychological deficiencies or disorders which might have been an accident of genetics and life experiences.
> 
> During one decade of my life that combined with a series of terrible events affecting not only my family, but also close friends and, to some extent, me as well. 
> 
> I could not reconcile that with the existence of an omnipowerful, omnipresent, and loving God. Now, I recognize that some people accept the idea of a creative godhead but believe that once having created the world "God" left evolution and humanity to their own devices. I find that completely unsatisfying. So was the bromide my priest(s) gave me that it's a mystery and we can't presume to understand it. I eagerly picked up a copy of that bestseller, "Why do good people suffer", to which I would add, why do children suffer through no possible fault of their own, and there were no answers there either.
> 
> As I've said before, my sense of justice and fairness is an integral part of my nature. So is a belief in the intellect and power of human understanding, prideful though that may be. It is indeed a cliche, but also profoundly tragic, that the world is not fair. Furthermore, if God didn't want us to understand all of these things why give us an intellect at all?
> 
> So, faith comes into conflict with both of my "animating" characteristics, if you will.
> ...


I used to accept the science and religion at the same time and used the same explanation that these religious writings are merely a reflection of a nature that represents something figural and that these words are not meant to be taken literally. It was a lame excuse but it worked.

When I started doing historical research and it kinda irked (deep down) because those other fake religions seems to very similar or better to say just a different variant of what have now in religion and later a recent check of religious text completely pushed me away gradually. It was something I saw but did not acknowledge immediately (because I did not want it to be true) but rather gradually.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> Based on what little information I can find on the subject, and my own interpretations, I believe humans were less afraid of death thousands of years ago than they are now. I think part of it might have been religion based, the other part was they dealt with death on a regular basis. They were closer to the natural world and understood death better.


Surelly, during the "contemporary epochs" it seems that the death question is the utterly tabboo.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

Very interesting thread with fully anthropological as well philisophical interest. And I say as well 
for the reason that: the results and the questions of the first are relatively measurable and clear but there is relatively validition 
when applied for the second. Such is the range of the difference that: Anthropology is interested for the "countable" and 
"visible" and "provable" answers up on a certain methodology kind of questions. While at the case of the Philosophy, it is
the questions that matters and not as much with the relatively "obvious" and "observable" aspects of the so 
called positive sciences. 


At that point I have to admit that anthropology is "Philosophy" and philosophy is "Anthropology" 
meaning that it is not such counterproposal terms and relatively oftenly interact as counterparts but as counteracts also.
Nothing safe when it cames for "words", apocalyptic reasons and truths up on such big matter like 
the Life and Death guestion.

No matter is the -every our "words"- theory about Death, when invades you realize 
that nothing can efficiently prepare us to handle the sorrow for our aparted beloved persons.
We have to grow up children and bury our parents... Then completeness will eventually comes.
That completeness summed in a feeling full of "absence". From that desperation sprouts the sperms of hope.


Hope, is like laughing with a bad joke; A joke that we will catch up the meaning later...

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

Who said that: Philosophy is study of death? 
The same one who mentions about Eros (love) at the "symposium"... He is the founder of the term "Philosophia", 
which considered from him as the "absolut science" (among with architecture and music).
Platon was his name and at that time Athens was in turbullent times. 
Such was the impact of Socrates death to Plato and such was the repercussion till today to us.


Societies shaped under the confrontation pressure of death events and tragic incidents.
(By the way... <<Jesus or Socrates>> will always be the quastion for the western part of this world.)


Somehow Death and Eros ghost our fears and wishes, it seems that Love is the absolut eguivalent for the fear
of death, at least for those being concerned at a personal and individual level. For those to be considered at 
a colleguial spectrum, I realize that culture (civilization) is the analogous correspondence for the handling
of the Death event.


So, If I summarize in a title that would be: <<The Death event and the dawn of civilizations>> somehow.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

(picture)
Having the "memento mori", death's remembrance;


Yesterday was "Souls-Saturday (Gr. Ψυχοσάββατο. > "Psychosabbato;") 


I borrowed the picture from a "hardcore punks" fanzine. (sic)
https://deathtotheworld.com/about/

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

There is a possibility if we could live for ever, maybe we wouldn't love each other... 
and maybe there wouldn't be any reason for -any of the- civilizations to exist.
Love and civilization requires further analysis but I justly reffered to, for the reasons being 
at the periphery of the Death question.


We may, don't clearly know what death is but we well know what is "eating" and those are:
Individuals and their "communions" too. So, Love and Culture is the absolut respond for the fear of death 
but is also the subject of death and that what feeds him. (-What an irony here!)
And follows harder.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

Since, we dont know what death is, why not to try to question it ?

Is it a foundamental element of the event of Life?
Is it just a parameter into a dynamic evoluted system forces of universe?
Is it an autonomous entity which counteracts against Life in the Eternity?


There is no science to answer that kind of questions. Hardly they can manage question about the origin of life.
Can we realize for a moment the time, the years of proccesing evolution after Big Bang.
The mass of the evolving material.? A mili-seconnd after? Or milli-secs before the explosion?
The monsterous forces that explode all things? 
The temperatures maybe?
The "decission" that forced all that "Move" ?


And even if we know. Can we digest the "sizes" ?
Simply no. Allthough being or trying to be assesed, counted and measured -from sciences- they are just inconcievable.


So, if the so called "obvious" - are hard to interprate, imagine how harder can be the absence of it.
Eg. The timeless Time or the No place Place. Or for example how difference could make for us
million of thousands more or less celsius deegres since we know that just fewer than a dozen deegrees
can eliminate the vast majority of life as we know it today ... and etc.


What the sciences can answer for us except the origins of our unbearable ignorance?   :Smile:

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## firetown

I don't understand the need to romanticize or glorify death avoiding speaking about what we have not done yet in life.

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## Angela

> I don't understand the need to romanticize or glorify death avoiding speaking about what we have not done yet in life.


Well, we certainly can't talk about it afterwards. :)

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> I don't understand the need to romanticize or glorify death avoiding speaking about what we have not done yet in life.


Maybe is a need to know but surelly is mostly not to fear. Maybe is just an anathema an aphorism or an apotropaic 
approach for those that will happen and we can't avoid.
It is very interesting what you say. I dont' know "what we haven't done yet" - allthough we could but we didn't.
You mean for example the "pill of eternity" or having a ticket to mars?
I dont perceive life like an deterministic process. So, I don't have to do something...to fullfil the programmed "big" plan
if that is what you mean. Here (Greece) we say that: "when a man plans, god laughs".

For me Death is the "black mater" (which actually is no material at all ) of mine aspect of universe, sort of. 
Simply saying: How would Life evoluted without death?

Maybe there is a lot to do with the culture and individual cases also, but it Isn't quite strange if you think that all the streets we are walking 
having the name of dead people. 

Sorry for my english which I dont feel confident at all, probably there is a miss of comprehension of mine, for what you mention.
I cannot have an straight answer it depends the person and its "enviroment". Thanks for that, I dont have to be absolut about any individual cases.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> Well, we certainly can't talk about it afterwards. :)



We have to be optimists, We can use hand-signs! 
If that's the problem.  :Smiling:

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## firetown

> Maybe is a need to know but surelly is mostly not to fear. Maybe is just an anathema an aphorism or an apotropaic 
> approach for those that will happen and we can't avoid.
> It is very interesting what you say. I dont' know "what we haven't done yet" - allthough we could but we didn't.
> You mean for example the "pill of eternity" or having a ticket to mars?
> I dont perceive life like an deterministic process. So, I don't have to do something...to fullfil the programmed "big" plan
> if that is what you mean. Here (Greece) we say that: "when a man plans, god laughs".
> 
> For me Death is the "black mater" (which actually is no material at all ) of mine aspect of universe, sort of. 
> Simply saying: How would Life evoluted without death?
> ...


For someone who isn't confident in his English, you sure have a rich vocabulary.
When it comes to what we have yet to do, I am also referring to how our attitude towards death can change.
If there is a lot you are working on, passionate about, doing, wanting to do, then death definitely is something you would want to avoid at any cost.
But then there are also those who sort of feel like their job on earth is done. This was brought up before, but I think that it is really about perceived purpose.
As for culture: death is a personal thing and I don't see that much of a real connection between cultural approach and your own personal upcoming experience.
I personally have never seen a dead person. Only once was I at the funeral of an infant, but the open casket was very far from me. I had a glimpse or two, but it didn't feel real to me. I am definitely not interested in ever seeing someone dead and uneasy about how it may affect me if I did. My 4 year old daughter however has already seen a dead person. Her and her mom drove by a motorcycle accident where the guy's head was split open and he was in a large pool of blood. My daughter talks about it in a more excited fashion like someone would describe a scene from a movie while her mom can hardly speak about it.
Again, there may come a time when I will feel like my "work here is done" and death will not be something terrifying.
It will all make sense to me one day (I believe), but the last thing I need is religion to play with and manipulate me with my fear of death.
I also don't ever want to be a burden to my family. If it ever gets to the point where I depend on others too much, I don't know how I would feel then, but right now my thoughts are that at such point, I would rather no longer be alive than holding back my loved ones in their lives and futures.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> For someone who isn't confident in his English, you sure have a rich vocabulary.
> When it comes to what we have yet to do, I am also referring to how our attitude towards death can change.
> If there is a lot you are working on, passionate about, doing, wanting to do, then death definitely is something you would want to avoid at any cost.
> But then there are also those who sort of feel like their job on earth is done. This was brought up before, but I think that it is really about perceived purpose.
> *As for culture: death is a personal thing and I don't see that much of a real connection between cultural approach and your own personal upcoming experience.*
> I personally have never seen a dead person. Only once was I at the funeral of an infant, but the open casket was very far from me. I had a glimpse or two, but it didn't feel real to me. I am definitely not interested in ever seeing someone dead and uneasy about how it may affect me if I did. My 4 year old daughter however has already seen a dead person. Her and her mom drove by a motorcycle accident where the guy's head was split open and he was in a large pool of blood. My daughter talks about it in a more excited fashion like someone would describe a scene from a movie while her mom can hardly speak about it.
> Again, there may come a time when I will feel like my "work here is done" and death will not be something terrifying.
> It will all make sense to me one day (I believe), but the last thing I need is religion to play with and manipulate me with my fear of death.
> I also don't ever want to be a burden to my family. If it ever gets to the point where I depend on others too much, I don't know how I would feel then, but right now my thoughts are that at such point, I would rather no longer be alive than holding back my loved ones in their lives and futures.


It wouldn't be fair to disagree for the reason I don't know something more -about death- that may you don't.

So, if the disagreement is about, -"How the death event influent cultures and civilizations"; I will note the followings:


First and mostly this is how it placed from the the thread starter (member ericrdpilot). As said:
<< _I believe humans were less afraid of death thousands of years ago than they are now. I think part of it might have been religion based,_ 
_the other part was they dealt with death on a regular basis..._>> That dont require further analysis, I think it is obvious.


The human creature is an entity which interacts and functions in a coordinated enviroment (society) and obedient to sustain 
and secure the common interest of the pack that it belongs. That means the individual persons are allguot materials of bigger and whole
organisms, let that be a pack of hunters; or villages; tonws; cities; states; or recently hyper ethnic schematisms like U.S or E.U, etc.
The "body" of society apparted fom humans -allthough humans- being different as persons, which their operational individualistic value it 
depends from their functionality and the recognition from and of the rest of the colleaques of the pack. 
For example: We are made from the same material but someone is the "heart", an other one is the "lungs", an other the "kidneys" but we all 
are part of the same body, a body -from the same material- which we have an expire date simillar of those of our natural physical ones.
In other words: I -personally- shaped and influented from others, in the same mechanim which I shape and influence others.
So, it is true and real to have the individualistic comprehensive of -mine;/yours;/ours; existance but only if we place it in an hyper-individual frame 
of synergies with other persons, characters and personalities.


We are social and political creatures which our prosperity, our future and survival depends from our common and customized needs,
depended from the challenges we face as individuals and collectivities ones. The bees cannot survive not even can have a try to live 
without belonging to a hive. It is not an hyperbole to admit that is not only our physical body but as well we are material of a greater 
body and that is colleguial one. (and believe me those are words from someone which enjoy his solitude like a bear..) 


So, if I sum it up and end with a conclusion which accordant with the previous -of mine- statements and place it in an ontological (of what is;)
frame of humane existance (and not a metaphysic one). I would say that:
One is our physical body.
An other one is the "social body.
And an other one is the "invisible" non-material one we call as soul or psyche which interacts with the previous two and both three serves
the demands of the unintelligible "Spirit" or "first move" or "God" or whatever -we can agree about it's nomination- which bond us all smehow. 
Away fom me any theological or conserved religious or theosophistries or theophobical narrations of Life and Death event. 
(or as I personally refer as "The Great Incident"...) 


Culture is love. Love is culture. And the more of them never harm anyone. (Well, that is debatable... but for the flow of the rhetoty,
we shall surpass, and rethink it later... If we, not yet be dead.) 
For all that and for even more which cannot share in a few paragraphs. I believe that death is an event with cultural extensions among others.
Which partially agree with the notions of member @ericdpilot.


Attention here please!
If I place a critique is for the desacralization neo-narratives of the postmodern totaliarinism and only.
e,g
<<Since we killed the God, what we shall do with the corpse?>>

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> For someone who isn't confident in his English, you sure have a rich vocabulary.
> When it comes to what we have yet to do, I am also referring to how our attitude towards death can change.
> If there is a lot you are working on, passionate about, doing, wanting to do, then death definitely is something you would want to avoid at any cost.
> But then there are also those who sort of feel like their job on earth is done. This was brought up before, but I think that it is really about perceived purpose.
> As for culture: death is a personal thing and I don't see that much of a real connection between cultural approach and your own personal upcoming experience.
> I personally have never seen a dead person. Only once was I at the funeral of an infant, but the open casket was very far from me. I had a glimpse or two, but it didn't feel real to me. I am definitely not interested in ever seeing someone dead and uneasy about how it may affect me if I did. My 4 year old daughter however has already seen a dead person. Her and her mom drove by a motorcycle accident where the guy's head was split open and he was in a large pool of blood. My daughter talks about it in a more excited fashion like someone would describe a scene from a movie while her mom can hardly speak about it.
> Again, there may come a time when I will feel like my "work here is done" and death will not be something terrifying.
> It will all make sense to me one day (I believe), but the last thing I need is religion to play with and manipulate me with my fear of death.
> I also don't ever want to be a burden to my family. If it ever gets to the point where I depend on others too much, I don't know how I would feel then, but right now my thoughts are that at such point, I would rather no longer be alive than holding back my loved ones in their lives and futures.


(Since you share a personal story , I'll do the same to my next posts to accompany you, - and lighten up the climate- 
before the big dive which may follows!)

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

I was close to five years old and maybe a bit less. It was typical afternoon heading to night.
My mother usually -at that time- preparing our evening supper, and oftenly among other delights 
she made for us (me and my sister) pastry leaves with feta (local fresh cheese) we call "tyro-pitakia" 
and it was of my favourites.


That afternoon it wasn't like the others we usually spent our times. We had our new (black and white) T.V.
at the living room and all of us we were a bit of excited, -well, not all exactly because my father was absent,
he had to worked all day to pay our new "dream device".
Me and my sister we were on the couch, the house it was full of the smells of our mother preparings and everything
looked and smelled perfect...We had the "tyro-pitakia" in front of us and surelly there would be ice cream after... But those 
serenity moments wouldn;t last for long, At that timeI was fully rest in my unbearable childish ignorrance.


That night at the t.v. program was the King Kong movie, the first one... And it was my first time 
that I had to confront with the absolut fear and the realization that wasn't any chance to get away of it.
<<We have big problem here>>.
I had terrible nightmares for a very long time... My mother couldn't answer my question <<-why we dying,>> 
my sister thought was that our parents they have to lock me to bedlam and my father's thought it was 
that the cheese consumption at evenings triggered the nightmares (which is rummored as local urban myth even today!)


Anyway, what it was obvious it was that the blond sexy woman somehow calm down Kong;s anxiety
and fpr me... Yes, for me an indian woman accompanied my pillow and protect me for a long time... 
(I wished to byed an medieval knight with sword and black and yellow shield with a silver "spangellhelm" 
but the small store run out of these.)


https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...lady-517669517



I early postulate that women somehow deal better with the secrets of Life and Death.
A woman bring us to life and usually women take care our bedsheets and the "shrouds" of our graves.
The men trained to be hard and ready to die only. We are the "expendables" Who is the first to die? 
If not the mature males to protect the rest of the family,/city,/country etc. 
Love is between as also "before" and "after". Love is everywhere... among with a lot of death around...
(By the way, tha';s why women love us, especially the hairy ones, like me and Kong . :Laughing: ) 


That was my first fear crisis incident which inherit me a "memento mori" sort of attitude, since on.

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## ΠΑΝΑΞ

> I was close to five years old and maybe a bit less..


 Correction :A bit older

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