# Humanities & Anthropology > Anthropology & Ethnography > Guess the Ethnicity >  Recognizing ethnicity by the nose.

## LeBrok

By nature of our sense of beauty, the most avarage face, or nose in this case is the most beautiful. Look at this one:



It is not even a real person but an image generated by averaging of many faces. It is not a very characteristic face, face to remember, yet is extremely balanced and beautiful. It is so average that, you would probably swear that you met person like this in your life. 
As with everything on this face, the nose is an average European nose. Not too small or big, not going up or down, not curved in any way. Average but beautiful. Nose like this one could be found all over the Europe and won't tell us much about where it comes from.

However, any deviation from this average can do the trick. Some parts of Europe have noses which are bigger, smaller, going up or down, narrow or wide. These characteristics can point us to a specific region or Europe, or ethnicity with very high likelihood.

Helpful diagram.



I'm not a phenotypical specialist by any stretch of imaginations, but I would like to present few of my observations, then discover about your observations, maybe find something new and intriguing.
Keep in mind that below pictures are not representations of general populations, especially if you don't like them, but just examples of characteristic noses that could be found there.

Let's have some fun!

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## LeBrok

Sorry for the title of this post, but I couldn't find examples till I typed this into google search.

This one is common in French or Alpine, and maybe Ashkenazi, (according to me :).
I think Depardieu is an extreme example but very characteristic. Nose is sort of wide at the tip with characteristic groove in the middle.


Swiss movie director:

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## LeBrok

I find it mostly in north Europe?

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## LeBrok

NW Europe?

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## LeBrok

Where is it from? North Europe?

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## LeBrok

Where is it most common?

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## LeBrok

Any ideas where it dominates?

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## LeBrok



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## Angela

I don't want to spoil the fun..._but_

I really don't think you can very reliably guess ethnicity by nose type. Even when you're looking at the whole package, it can be difficult in some cases. There's a lot of overlap.

Grooved tip-Matteo Renzi-ancestry from Marche and Toscana-:


His nose is also short and broad, although there's more cartilage than in your English examples.

Short with a wide base-Riccardo Scamarico:


Convex nose-Francois Hollande


Long, narrow, bony nose-Alan Cumming:

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## LeBrok



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## LeBrok

> I don't want to spoil the fun..._but_
> 
> I really don't think you can very reliably guess ethnicity by nose type. Even when you're looking at the whole package, it can be difficult in some cases. There's a lot of overlap.


It is almost impossible thing to do, most noses contain many of these characteristics and can be found all over Europe. However, it will be interesting in some of these cases to find regions where they persist the most. I'm hoping that in the future we can figure out from genetic code what came from where. We might pinpoint the shape of IE nose from steppes, or nose (not mentioning other features) of first farmers, etc. Or what characteristics just bloomed from bottlenecking in regions in Europe.

It is mostly for fun here, nothing really scientific, if there is fun in discovering some patterns and listen to people's opinions. I might be perfectly wrong in my perceptions.

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## LeBrok



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## LeBrok



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## LeBrok

How about this flat place on top of nose ridge?

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## Angela

Some more examples of the variety in one province of one country: Toscana, Italia

Ed. Now that I think about it, Italy would be the last place to look for clues about origin...too much variety.

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## LeBrok

Are Serbian and Bosnians with most downward pointing noses?








I think this picture represents a very characteristic Serbian/Bosnian nose:

Is it unique enough to possibly represent quick I2-Dinaric expansion in Balkans?

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## Fire Haired14

> I find it mostly in north Europe?


Interesting, that's what I have. As do, most of the people on my north-central Euro side of the family.

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## Yetos

interesting,

and my favorite question every time with noises, is him



or 




a nose typical from Caucas Georgia to Armenia to Kurds to Levant to Balkans to Italy, and maybe Iberia
but not above the Alps, do not know how common in North Italy

could he be of Caucasian, minor Asian, Persian, etc ancestry?





and what about him?



is this the typical Karelian? or Uralic nose?

is it the same with this one?







btw, 
I believe the strongest point of I2b1 is the mandible, very wide











zoran Savic and Zarko Paspalje, 2 old but unforgetable basketball players

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## LeBrok

You asked my "expert" opinion, here it goes, lol:




> interesting,
> 
> and my favorite question every time with noises, is him
> 
> 
> 
> or 
> 
> 
> ...


Who knows, don't forget that it might be even a much older nose of first farmers.








> and what about him?
> 
> is this the typical Karelian? or Uralic nose?


Definitely northern type, the ski jump nose. The tip and nostrils are fairly common to NE Europe.







> is it the same with this one?


Hitler's wide base is northern european kind, I guess, but the fairly large nose and its straight profile perhaps more southern/central type.

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## LeBrok

Usually a ridge of a nose don't line up with forehead, creating bigger or smaller indentation, a meniscus, at the place they join.


Some time ago in Greece there were people with a very tall nose bridge, with nose and forehead with almost parallel lines.






Can this nose be found in Greece today?

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## Yetos

> Usually a ridge of a nose don't line up with forehead, creating bigger or smaller indentation, a meniscus, at the place they join.
> 
> 
> Some time ago in Greece there were people with a very tall nose bridge, with nose and forehead with almost parallel lines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can this nose be found in Greece today?


yes, 
my father had such, thin and start from above eyes

but that is the perfect, the godess nose

check this

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## LeBrok

East Europe Ural area.


Komi people


Udmart


Karelian


Are Karelian noses pointing down?

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## Yetos

the first photo seems original Turk to me

I got your point,

trouth is I can recogn a possible Armenian from a possible Kurd from a possibleTurk from a possible Georgian,

but not a Northern one, except Norwegians, and not all the time,

i ussually regogn them from the big forehead, brow, face front






although i could fall in love with her  :Heart: , she certainly is not southern than alps or danube 

or him

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## Dalmat

Croats often have huge beaks, myself included

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## LeBrok

Gravettian from Czech Republic, about 20 thousand years old.



Wide base, fleshy nostrils and extremely pointed upward. It is hard to find a nose like this one today, though some could be found in north Europe.






Or actress Carrey Mulligan.

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## Jovialis

This is George Washington's Life mask, it is the most accurate depiction of his face. It was a plaster cast made during his lifetime:



*

*Looks like a Roman nose to me.

https://www.themorgan.org/collection/George-Washington-Life-Mask

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## Angela

> This is George Washington's Life mask, it is the most accurate depiction of his face. It was a plaster cast made during his lifetime:
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> *Looks like a Roman nose to me.
> 
> https://www.themorgan.org/collection/George-Washington-Life-Mask


To me too. :)

In his lifetime it was called a “noble” nose.

I think I posted a picture of Thomas Payne above. His nose is just like that of Scipio Africanus. 

John Adams’ nose is so curved it almost looks Semitic.

It must be CHG and steppe related in them. That and maybe the French influence.

It’s always struck me how often leaders in Western Europe had such prominent noses. It used to be said such noses indicated strength of personality and will. I highly doubt that’s true but I can believe that people thought that and consciously or subconsciously chose their leaders in part because of that.

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## Archetype0ne

Courtesy of kingjohn from the Napoleon I thread. https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...117#post610117 


https://vintagenewsdaily.com/death-m...eon-bonaparte/

These type of noses sure pop up a lot from classical times to modern times in "nobility".



From paintings:

As a young Corsican Lieutenant 


Napoleon crowned King of Italy.


During the famous and controversial coronation where he took the crown from the Pope and crowned himself.

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## Angela

> Courtesy of kingjohn from the Napoleon I thread. https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...117#post610117 
> 
> 
> https://vintagenewsdaily.com/death-m...eon-bonaparte/
> 
> These type of noses sure pop up a lot from classical times to modern times in "nobility".
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It’s what I call the “Flora” nose from the Greek statue of the goddess Flora but with the addition of the Roman “bump”.

The “Flora” nose is ubiquitous from Toscana through Umbria, Marche, Eastern Liguria and Emilia Romagna. There’s a whole monograph written about this look in women of the area when discussing DaVinci’s Lady with the Ermine, who was a Tuscan. At the height of the Lega Nord drama they posted copies of this portrait with a caption saying: This is what Italians look like....

They probably thought she was Milanese since that’s where it was painted. :)

I can’t post pictures; perhaps someone else can do it. You can also look at my threads: Phenotypes of Italian villages and People of the Appennino Parmense.

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## Archetype0ne

> It’s what I call the “Flora” nose from the Greek statue of the goddess Flora but with the addition of the Roman “bump”.
> 
> The “Flora” nose is ubiquitous from Toscana through Umbria, Marche, Eastern Liguria and Emilia Romagna. There’s a whole monograph written about this look in women of the area when discussing DaVinci’s Lady with the Ermine, who was a Tuscan. At the height of the Lega Nord drama they posted copies of this portrait with a caption saying: This is what Italians look like....
> 
> They probably thought she was Milanese since that’s where it was painted. :)
> 
> I can’t post pictures; perhaps someone else can do it. You can also look at my threads: Phenotypes of Italian villages and People of the Appennino Parmense.


I will oblige:


DaVinci’s Lady with the Ermine


Compare to Flora.




I think why these prominent figures have a mix between the Roman bump and the Grecian nose is due to testosterone. Have no proof to back it up but intuitively that's what I think.

From the picture of the most beautiful man according to ancient Greeks you can see that there is a certain bump, it is not a straight Grecian nose:

"Antinous, the lover of Hadrian, was considered the most beautiful man of his time"



Michelangelo's David





Caesar 



Alexander



Skanderbeg



I think all these figures have a hybrid nose between Grecian and Roman, straight/concave in men with a bump, as I said my guess is testosterone in men makes the Flora nose have a bump.

Even DaVinci had a similar nose aparently.



Here is Micheangelo himself.


Would love your guys opinion, weather testosterone can affect the bump on the nose, so as to create a hybrid between the Grecian nose and Roman nose in men.

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## Angela

> I will oblige:
> 
> 
> DaVinci’s Lady with the Ermine
> 
> 
> Compare to Flora.
> 
> 
> ...


Keep in mind that in the idealized nose of the Greek sculptors, whether in men or women, there’s no break or dip at all at the eyes. Look at Antinous: it’s a straight line from the forehead through the top of the nose. I’ve never seen that in realistic Roman busts of real people and rarely afterwards. It’s rarely seen anywhere, which leads me to wonder if it really existed in any great numbers.

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## Archetype0ne

> Keep in mind that in the idealized nose of the Greek sculptors, whether in men or women, there’s no break or dip at all at the eyes. Look at Antinous: it’s a straight line from the forehead through the top of the nose. I’ve never seen that in realistic Roman busts of real people and rarely afterwards. It’s rarely seen anywhere, which leads me to wonder if it really existed in any great numbers.


I agree. To me it is more noticeable on the female statues, this case Flora, the straight line. Because I am pretty sure I have seen people having similar nose forehead line to Antinous. It is certainly idealized. But it is not like on his bust you can take a ruler and run it to the tip of his nose from the top of his forehead. While on the Flora statue I can see a ruler going from her forehead to the tip of the nose.

But yeah I agree. Doubt it was ubiquitous.
Just based on anecdotes I see a lot of similarity for example between the Ceasar nose and the Napoleon one. Even George Washington for that matter. Or for the matter any of the pictures I posted. It is like you synthesized the Roman bump with the thin, more often concave line in men of the Grecian nose. 

The fact that the bust of Antinous bares such similarity with death masks (in this case Washington, Napoleon) certainly is not a coincidence. Is it ubiquitous over such a huge geographical location, most certainly not.

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## Angela

> Keep in mind that in the idealized nose of the Greek sculptors, whether in men or women, there’s no break or dip at all at the eyes. Look at Antinous: it’s a straight line from the forehead through the top of the nose. I’ve never seen that in realistic Roman busts of real people and rarely afterwards. It’s rarely seen anywhere, which leads me to wonder if it really existed in any great numbers.


Look up the profile of Minerva but also of Apollo. 

It even appears as late as in The Statue of Liberty.

I have no proof but my hunch is that it was an idealization and an artistic convention.

There are women who have that Roman bump although I don’t, nor did my mother. Just look up pictures of Meryl Streep in profile, though.

There are men who don’t have it either like Gabriele Garko.

When I speak about the Flora nose being common in certain areas of Italy I mean the Modified Flora nose, with a slight indent at the eyes, and then long and straight.

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## Ailchu

in case someone was wondering here is the nose from before


it's Pascal Couchepin former swiss Bundesrat.

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## Angela

> in case someone was wondering here is the nose from before
> 
> 
> it's Pascal Couchepin former swiss Bundesrat.


Well he would definitely have fooled me. Just goes to show you can’t tell the ethnicity of a person from a nose although you may be able to tell the general part of the world where the nose originated.

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## Archetype0ne

> in case someone was wondering here is the nose from before
> 
> 
> it's Pascal Couchepin former swiss Bundesrat.





> Is that a politician? Don't know why I get that feeling. LOL


So do I get any points?  :Laughing: 




> Well he would definitely have fooled me. Just goes to show you can’t tell the ethnicity of a person from a nose although you may be able to tell the general part of the world where the nose originated.


Might not be able to tell ethnicity... but my spider senses/intuition sure got the profession right.  :Laughing:

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## Jovialis

Norwegian author Sven Moren:



He is from Trysil, Norway. I am not sure how to determine it.

Another author from the same town, Einar Skjæraasen, whose nose is much different.

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## Archetype0ne

> Norwegian author Sven Moren:
> 
> 
> 
> He is from Trysil, Norway. I am not sure how to determine it.
> 
> Another author from the same town, Einar Skjæraasen, whose nose is much different.


First one reminds me of Tesla, second one of Camus.

Anyone wants to take a guess at this individuals nose?




Lets see if anybody gets it right.

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## don_joe

> Norwegian author Sven Moren:
> 
> 
> 
> He is from Trysil, Norway. I am not sure how to determine it.
> 
> Another author from the same town, Einar Skjæraasen, whose nose is much different.


ArchetypeOne wrote that he looks quite like Tesla...definitely. He looks also a lot like my father and has some features that my family from his side has. They come from an area in Croatia maybe some 100 km north from Tesla's birthplace.

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## Jovialis

> First one reminds me of Tesla, second one of Camus.
> Anyone wants to take a guess at this individuals nose?
> 
> 
> Lets see if anybody gets it right.


That looks like Hitler's nose.

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## Archetype0ne

> That looks like Hitler's nose.


Indeed. Well done  :Good Job: .  :Clap:  


Edit: Forgot to post pictures the snipets are from.




How would you classify it?

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## Jovialis

> Indeed. Well done .  
> 
> 
> Edit: Forgot to post pictures the snipets are from.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How would you classify it?


Not too sure actually, in how to describe it. I knew it was him, because I recently looked up his picture to see what kind of nose he had.

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## Angela

Great Roman bump on Sven Moren’s nose I think; attractive man.

What an ugly profile Hitler had. Nothing wrong with the nose itself; my dad had a jutting wedge shaped nose like that too. It’s that it slants upward at the bottom and the forehead is so ugly.

Take it back a little. It looks level in the second picture

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## Angela

In the first half of the twentieth century people swooned over the profile of the great actor John Barrymore; one of the closest imo to the classic Greek noses of ancient statuary.

He was so proud of it that practically every picture is of his profile

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## Angela

I take it back. I didn't remember Barrymore's nose correctly. There's a definite dip at the eyes. Still a beautiful nose and beautiful profile.





Another gorgeous, classic profile: Elvis Presley. In some pictures it almost looks perfectly Grecian, but in others you can see the slight dip.

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## ihype02

Paul Newman and Apollo, nuff said:

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## Jovialis

Gabriele D'Annunzio, the famous Italian poet, former-dictator of Fiume (today Rijeka, Croatia), and man who invented fascism, had a Roman nose.

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## Angela

You really can't tell ethnicity by the nose.

This is Neville Chamberlain. The nose looks Semitic to me, yet he was a proper English upper class gentlemen.





Ironically, Oswald Mosley, head of the English fascist party also had that type of nose. Whatever did Hitler think of it? :)


Mussolini's nose was much more like Hitler's. The ironies and absurdities of "racial typology".

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## kingjohn

> You really can't tell ethnicity by the nose.
> 
> This is Neville Chamberlain. The nose looks Semitic to me, yet he was a proper English upper class gentlemen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ironically, Oswald Mosley, head of the English fascist party also had that type of nose. Whatever did Hitler think of it? :)
> ...



You are correct here is my uncle( brother of my father)

Roman nose( bump than straight)
https://i.imgur.com/MpqXXDC.jpg

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## MOESAN

> You really can't tell ethnicity by the nose.
> 
> 
> 
> Mussolini's nose was much more like Hitler's. The ironies and absurdities of "racial typology".


I disagree for a part.
common stereotypes are not scientific types which themselves cannot be confused with true well achieved "races", even if the concept of "race" could be discussed even for animals.
In my conception types are *tries* to construct an *ideal* phenotype which could correspond to some elementary subpopulation in a global mixed one, subpopulation supposed to have lived independantly some times before to took part in the mix, and whose the input could be weighted more or less precisely. It's a risky sport but not without interest. It is based upon states, but not global states concerning a whole pop, where the means don't give too much clues sometimes concerning the making of the mix; that said it requires some other pops less mixed where a type dominates more so that the global mean is closer to the type means. I avow the results are often disappointing, and the "scientists" who competed on the field in past have been more often rather bad! But the metrics method of comparing global means of measures without a bit of typology can confuse us very well and pass over precious details, among them the features rarely accutely reflected by the battery of measures taken.
the nose, as the mouth, more than the mouth, mirrors the mixings very well, so it's very rare to have a "pure type" nose (the more numerous the alleles in cause, the less unity in the pop). That said, among 'europoids' there are some clear tendancies, even if never completely homogenous.
That said, in this thread, we are doing cherry picking, even the ones who are opposed to it as a rule. Chamberlain and others may not be taken as model for their population. And I think there is not everytime ONE gene for say "convex" nose, or "concave" nose or "winding" nose or "beaky nose" or any other case, to take only one aspect. some convex nose can be the homozygotic result of an allele, other convex noses can be the result of an heterozygotic association; sure they are not exactly the same noses, but they will be classified generally as "convex noses". But in nose we have the bones association, the cartilages one, the flesh one, without to speak of the connexion glabella/superior nose bridge. 
Some crossings of basic types can produce at the idividual level close enough results spite they are not formed by the very same basic types. 
&: this plurifactors construction of the nose makes that every pop shows diverse variants of features, even brothers and sisters what doesn't exclude that some forms prevail in certain pops.

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## Angela

> I disagree for a part.
> common stereotypes are not scientific types which themselves cannot be confused with true well achieved "races", even if the concept of "race" could be discussed even for animals.
> In my conception types are *tries* to construct an *ideal* phenotype which could correspond to some elementary subpopulation in a global mixed one, subpopulation supposed to have lived independantly some times before to took part in the mix, and whose the input could be weighted more or less precisely. It's a risky sport but not without interest. It is based upon states, but not global states concerning a whole pop, where the means don't give too much clues sometimes concerning the making of the mix; that said it requires some other pops less mixed where a type dominates more so that the global mean is closer to the type means. I avow the results are often disappointing, and the "scientists" who competed on the field in past have been more often rather bad! But the metrics method of comparing global means of measures without a bit of typology can confuse us very well and pass over precious details, among them the features rarely accutely reflected by the battery of measures taken.
> the nose, as the mouth, more than the mouth, mirrors the mixings very well, so it's very rare to have a "pure type" nose (the more numerous the alleles in cause, the less unity in the pop). That said, among 'europoids' there are some clear tendancies, even if never completely homogenous.
> That said, in this thread, we are doing cherry picking, even the ones who are opposed to it as a rule. *Chamberlain and others may not be taken as model for their population. And I think there is not everytime ONE gene for say "convex" nose, or "concave" nose or "winding" nose or "beaky nose" or any other case, to take only one aspect. some convex nose can be the homozygotic result of an allele, other convex noses can be the result of an heterozygotic association; sure they are not exactly the same noses, but they will be classified generally as "convex noses". But in nose we have the bones association, the cartilages one, the flesh one, without to speak of the connexion glabella/superior nose bridge. 
> Some crossings of basic types can produce at the idividual level close enough results spite they are not formed by the very same basic types. 
> &: this plurifactors construction of the nose makes that every pop shows diverse variants of features, even brothers and sisters what doesn't exclude that some forms prevail in certain pops.*



Completely agree with your bolded comment. This thread is more for fun than anything else. In particular, the thought of Hitler looking at the nose of Chamberlain during negotiations for "appeasement" appealed to my ironic and sometimes sardonic sense of humor, as did Oswald Mosley's nose given his speeches. 

I do, however, still maintain that upper class Brits tend, more often than lower class ones, to have aquiline, or Greek, or Roman, etc. noses. As I've said before I don't know why. Perhaps influence from France after the Norman conquest, or going all the way back to the first Beakers who arrived? 

I'm not saying physical anthropology has no input which should be considered, and didn't mean to insult the whole field or those interested in it. Sorry if that's how it came across.

However, it has always struck me as beyond ludicrous how Nazi "doctors" and "scientists" were going around with their measuring tools to find out who was "Aryan" or not (not too successful, as more than one Jewish child made it into the Hitler Youth), especially given the looks of some of their own leaders. 
r
Goebels never struck me as "Aryan" looking, and he was a poor physical specimen to boot, with his club foot, given the pronouncements of the Nazi party. Other children with those handicaps were often gassed. I guess even in Nazi Germany personal contacts mattered. To compensate he married a much larger, very blonde, very German looking woman who was a complete Nazi fanatic, and who killed all their children, before killing herself, so they wouldn't have to live in a world without Hitler and "National Socialism". 

The other ludicrous situation was that they had to make all Italians "Aryans" too, and I'm sure there were more than a few who wouldn't have passed the head and facial measurement tests.

It was all a perversion of science, and a complete disgrace, and tainted this sort of work, unfairly, to be sure. Their legal system as well, where their judiciary approved all sorts of horrors permitted by rules from the party, was a disgrace.

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## MOESAN

> Completely agree with your bolded comment. This thread is more for fun than anything else. In particular, the thought of Hitler looking at the nose of Chamberlain during negotiations for "appeasement" appealed to my ironic and sometimes sardonic sense of humor, as did Oswald Mosley's nose given his speeches. 
> 
> I do, however, still maintain that upper class Brits tend, more often than lower class ones, to have aquiline, or Greek, or Roman, etc. noses. As I've said before I don't know why. Perhaps influence from France after the Norman conquest, or going all the way back to the first Beakers who arrived? 
> 
> I'm not saying physical anthropology has no input which should be considered, and didn't mean to insult the whole field or those interested in it. Sorry if that's how it came across.
> 
> However, it has always struck me as beyond ludicrous how Nazi "doctors" and "scientists" were going around with their measuring tools to find out who was "Aryan" or not (not too successful, as more than one Jewish child made it into the Hitler Youth), especially given the looks of some of their own leaders. 
> r
> Goebels never struck me as "Aryan" looking, and he was a poor physical specimen to boot, with his club foot, given the pronouncements of the Nazi party. Other children with those handicaps were often gassed. I guess even in Nazi Germany personal contacts mattered. To compensate he married a much larger, very blonde, very German looking woman who was a complete Nazi fanatic, and who killed all their children, before killing herself, so they wouldn't have to live in a world without Hitler and "National Socialism". 
> ...


OK with your last explanations. I was only trying to moderate the absolute or extreme affirmations we could gather from some posts.

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## Ailchu

> I disagree for a part.
> common stereotypes are not scientific types which themselves cannot be confused with true well achieved "races", even if the concept of "race" could be discussed even for animals.
> In my conception types are *tries* to construct an *ideal* phenotype which could correspond to some elementary subpopulation in a global mixed one, subpopulation supposed to have lived independantly some times before to took part in the mix, and whose the input could be weighted more or less precisely. It's a risky sport but not without interest. It is based upon states, but not global states concerning a whole pop, where the means don't give too much clues sometimes concerning the making of the mix; that said it requires some other pops less mixed where a type dominates more so that the global mean is closer to the type means. I avow the results are often disappointing, and the "scientists" who competed on the field in past have been more often rather bad! But the metrics method of comparing global means of measures without a bit of typology can confuse us very well and pass over precious details, among them the features rarely accutely reflected by the battery of measures taken.
> the nose, as the mouth, more than the mouth, mirrors the mixings very well, so it's very rare to have a "pure type" nose (the more numerous the alleles in cause, the less unity in the pop). That said, among 'europoids' there are some clear tendancies, even if never completely homogenous.
> That said, in this thread, we are doing cherry picking, even the ones who are opposed to it as a rule. Chamberlain and others may not be taken as model for their population. And I think there is not everytime ONE gene for say "convex" nose, or "concave" nose or "winding" nose or "beaky nose" or any other case, to take only one aspect. some convex nose can be the homozygotic result of an allele, other convex noses can be the result of an heterozygotic association; sure they are not exactly the same noses, but they will be classified generally as "convex noses". But in nose we have the bones association, the cartilages one, the flesh one, without to speak of the connexion glabella/superior nose bridge. 
> Some crossings of basic types can produce at the idividual level close enough results spite they are not formed by the very same basic types. 
> &: this plurifactors construction of the nose makes that every pop shows diverse variants of features, even brothers and sisters what doesn't exclude that some forms prevail in certain pops.


how do you think did this noseshape start to exist?
swiss
njhgg.jpg
french


it looks similar to the one of Couchepin and it's not a nose type common among jewish people even if people might guess it is. it's way more common in some parts of europe actually.
what would be the "pure" types underlying this nose shape?
maybe a bit neanderthal?

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## Jovialis

Giulio Evola had a roman nose.

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## MOESAN

> how do you think did this noseshape start to exist?
> swiss
> njhgg.jpg
> french
> 
> 
> it looks similar to the one of Couchepin and it's not a nose type common among jewish people even if people might guess it is. it's way more common in some parts of europe actually.
> what would be the "pure" types underlying this nose shape?
> maybe a bit neanderthal?


I don't see too evident input of a mixing in these noses, uneasy to say, indeed.
In ancient posts, I wrote abut homozygoty and heterozygoty. I was not so clear, even if people seemed understanding my points.
In fact in my thought, the most surprising results in crossings appear not when there is heterozygoty at every mesh of the chain of acting alleles (at the contrary even) but when there is homozygoty ("uni-type") at every pair of alleles, allied to a perturbated ("multi-types") chain: here I can expect the most surprising results, very often judged more or less ugly because it doesn't respond to a mainstream social/cultural conception of beauty. EG, disruption of homogenous ethnic origins between the nose parts (bone, cartilage, muscle/flesh, nostrils...
It's a personal view, a try to understand some features, not scientific. But it could explain why very often some population where a slighty (numerically) dominant feature is taken as an ethnic typical pattern (like Armenian for noses) we find everytime an opposite trend for concave noses or at least for noses with very different features, not "average" in the common sense. This is common too in other pops, BTW. The most homogenous pops for features show rather less "typical" features.

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## Regio X

Carlo Maria Giulini






https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JXdTTQh69o&t=2852s

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## Angela

> Carlo Maria Giulini
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JXdTTQh69o&t=2852s


Looks somewhat like the profile on the Vatican Museum bust of Caesar, although Caesar famously had black eyes, so I imagine his hair was dark too.

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## Jovialis

> Gabriele D'Annunzio, the famous Italian poet, former-dictator of Fiume (today Rijeka, Croatia), and man who invented fascism, had a Roman nose.


Gabriele D'Annunzio also believed himself to be descended from the ancient Greeks and Romans. For that, he was right; he was from Abruzzo.

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## Angela

I've been watching a PBS detective series called Endeavor, about the young years of "Morse". I finally say a REAL Roman nose. If you want to see it in the "round", it's Season 8, episode 2.

There aren't that many pictures of him, and most are not real profile pictures.



He's an English actor named Joe Gallina, clearly of Italian or part Italian extraction:


Not my type, too brutal, but he looks as if he came down from a plinth of a Greek or Roman warrior. 




Another English actor of part Italian ancestry (the other half is Austrian): Mark Strong.

It looks a bit like Napoleon's nose to me.



In Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy:

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## kingjohn

agree he look like a roman warrior 
gallina surname is italian :)

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## Angela

You can see posts before they're submitted???

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## BillMC

> There aren't that many pictures of him, and most are not real profile pictures.


Superman is an extraterrestrial alien from the planet Krypton.

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## Angela

> Superman is an extraterrestrial alien from the planet Krypton.


Well, don't want to spoil anything, but he's not really Superman, just like Johnny Depp didn't really have scissors for hands. :)

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