# General Discussion > Opinions >  Are you vegetarian ?

## Maciamo

Vegetarianism is growing fast in Western countries. It used to be the norm in most of Asia and still is for Hindus and Jainists.
Japan used to be a vegetarian country (except for fish and seafood), but now counts less vegetarians than any other developed countries.

What about you ?

I am not.

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## Sekabin

I was vegetarian, for over 10 years... until I met my wife... then we went to Japan and well, it's downright impossible to be veggie there (fish are not vegetables guys and gals). You can't avoid 'dashi'. So now I'm mostly vegetarian, i.e. i mostly don't eat meat or fish, but occasionally (getting more frequent) I eat fish.

When we live in Japan I guess I'll eat even more fish.
 :Ramen:

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## Iron Chef

I am, but only until recently (going on a month-and-a-half now). No specific reason for why really, I love a good charred hunk of meat just as much as the next guy/gal. Just trying something new I guess (or until the I grow bored with my newfound diet).
:)

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## Mandylion

Yes, I am, mainly because I can rarely afford meat in Japan, and I've never really learned to cook fish well. I'll eat some amount of meat, 3 oz or so, maybe once every two or three weeks. So I guess I am a defacto psuedo-veggie. But recently, even given the chance to eat large amounts of meat, I find myself not. Large slabs of beef now seem a bit more revolting for both what it will do to my gut and the ethical issues.

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## mdchachi

> we went to Japan and well, it's downright impossible to be veggie there
Well not impossible but I agree it's pretty difficult. I knew one strict vegetarian (Indian guy) in Japan. Needless to say he didn' t eat much Japanese food. When we went out to eat it was usually to an Indian or Italian restaurant (usually they have arabiata pasta which does not have meat).

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## neko_girl22

I'm kinda vegetarian (I eat fish) but not out of choice. It's that diet the traditional asian medicine doctor put me on. not a diet to lose weight, a diet for my health. It's very strict.

I wouldn't mind so much if it actually was working......
 :Sick:

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## Sekabin

> _Originally posted by mdchachi_ 
> *> we went to Japan and well, it's downright impossible to be veggie there
> Well not impossible but I agree it's pretty difficult. I knew one strict vegetarian (Indian guy) in Japan. Needless to say he didn' t eat much Japanese food. When we went out to eat it was usually to an Indian or Italian restaurant (usually they have arabiata pasta which does not have meat).*


Yeah you're right, it's not impossible. Actually some of the veggie restaurants serve the tastiest food I had in Japan. My cousin is in Osaka and is a strict vegetarian - she's completely miserable and always cooks for herself, buying expensive imported ingredients.

I think vegetarianism is becoming less popular in the UK, so there's no hope for Japan!  :Laughing:

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## jeisan

meat is good

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## Marc

I love meat.
Could anyone explain to me what are the reasons to become a vegan? I've questioned a friend, who claims to be a vegan, once but he told me I wouldn't understand.
Animal killing and religion aspects sound quite reasonable to me, but what about animal products? Is there a real reason to not consume them?

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## Maciamo

Hi Marc,

Veganism seems more to be a caprice than a reasonable choice, since it is not healthy for human to live with low protein diets or avoid any animal products.

But I understand why vegetarianism is popular. It's not good either to eat only meat (you know like having a beefsteak for breakfast). Balance is the most important. If someone doesn't eat meat then they should eat a lot of dairy products, eggs, beans, etc.

I personnaly stopped eating beef in (or from) developped countries since the mad cow disease. I know there has been no cases in the US or Australia yet, but even if there was I think Americans would try hard to conceal it to preserve their economy. What's more there's been cases in Canada and when I came to Japan everybody was sure it would never happen to Japanese beef ; one month later, the first BSE case was found - and there has been several cases in all the country since then. As cows in Hokkaido and Chiba aren't related, it means there _was_ already BSE before, maybe for several years, but that nobody had tested it or discovered it (even when tested, it's not that easy to trace BSE in a cow. Best proof, a vet commited suicide in Hokkaido for failing to trace it for several years and thus endangering people's life). 

As long as I am in Japan, I don't miss beef at all. There is so much fish and seafood that I am content. But in Europe that would be tougher to live without beef at all and just live on pork and chicken. The alternative is kangaroo or emu meat.  :Blush:

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## Fruitarian

im of only eat Fresh Fruit!!!!!!!! and raww foods so i am not have the impacted feces in my colon!!!!!! no meat,candy,cake,icecream,milk,eggs,no of the cooked food!!!!!!

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## Keiichi

Lots of vegetarians here. ^^ But I'm not one. I was raised with meat also, so I don't suppose decreasing my protein by stopping would be too healthy for me.

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## Sekabin

most people actually eat too much protein in their diet. Unless you're a body builder you don't need as much as that. And balance *is* everything - as a Vegan you can be healthy if you eat the right things in the right amounts. Dairy products aren't necessary, you can get all the same things from other sources.... just many vegans don't!

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## Tare. Aura Violette

I'm vegetarian I suppose
I hate meat, hate the taste of it

I only eat it if I am forced too

but I don't consider pepperoni and THINLY sliced roast beef to be in the "doesn't taste good" group on a rare occasion I will eat that

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## dark for tears

I am and I am not. I don't eat much meat. The occasional bit of chicken is all I have.

Being raised as a Hindu I've never had beef. However then when I decided I wasn't religious I had beef, and wel I just do not like it.

I don't really like fish much, nor pork, or lamb.

So i guess you could call me a veggie, but I eat chicken. Lol, Im just halfway there

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## elisakim

I'm a vegan, 100% vegetarian. 
After I realized what I was actually eating it sickened me and I felt barbaric and dirty. So I just stopped, it took awhile to become a complete vegetarian. It is worth it though because I'm skinner then before and have more energy plus I feel really clean and pure inside. Not just my body but my 'soul' too. Having complete control over my body, after having hardly none at all (I was raised to eat meat), makes me feel powerful in a strange way..I mean, now I really realize that this body is just that, a body. Its not me, so I'm not gonna let it control me. I just feel above everything, not in a snobby way but a god-like pure way. It just feels natural to be a vegetarian, like a return to the Earth. It sounds corny b/c I don't know how to explain things well. Oh, I never get sick either. The only time I even get a little pain feeling is when I have a headache from stress. Eh..it's up to you all. Have a nice day everybody!!

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## Sekabin

I have a theory (now no-one get offended by this), that being a vegetarian is, at times, the same as being phobic. For a long time when I was younger (and more strictly veggie) I couldn't even stand the thought of eating meat if someone accidently cooked for me. I would rationalise this feeling in all sorts of ways, but ultimately it was a similar response to a phobia. This was one of the reasons why I decided to become less strict - sort of like elisakim's control over my body, but in a reverse way.

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## Himura

Meat ruleZ!!!  :Cool:

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## Sekabin

Well, actually I don't think eating meat *is* a good thing for most people. It doesn't seem to be as healthy as many claim, and lets face it - there's just too many people to support a meaty diet for everyone!

;)

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## Meo

I've been a vegetarian for about five months, and am hoping to go vegan some day.

I went veggie for ethical reasons. I don't support the animal cruelty in the meat industry (if you don't know anything about it, you can check out www.meetyourmeat.com and watch the video if you want to). I also realized that eating the flesh of another being was just wrong to me. I felt incredibly bad doing it, so I stopped. I don't think that I could eat meat (or any byproducts, working on cutting out cheese and dairy), even if the treatment in factories was better.

One thing I'd like to say is to clear up the term "vegetarian". Many people now days think that eating poultry or fish only still makes you a vegetarian, when it does not. Those would be pseudo and semi vegetarians. It's nice to have people establish the differences so there's no confusion with vegetarians who eat no meat (face it, fish, chicken, turkeys, etc. all do _not_ grow on trees).

Cheers!

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## maji

one of my flatmates is vegan, and the two others were once vegetarian but now eat meat again.
ive always been a carnivore. ;)

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## mdchachi

Stop it you guys. All this talk is making me feel like having a big, thick, juicy bacon cheeseburger.

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## Nanahara

I'm veggie, well most of the time...sometimes I have to eat chicken or turkey (Christmas and family occasions)

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## Satori

I've been a vegetarian all my life. Why anyone would want pieces of a dead animal in their food is beyond me. ;)

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## Frank D. White

All my life, I've hated vegtables and lived on meat & potatoes.
Most of the time I live on junk food and soda which cost me all my teeth ! Old age and married life are causing me to change my ways though.

Frank

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## Panda

I am an interesting case. I can eat it but as long as I don't prepare it or kill the meat or what someone else do it. If I don't see it until it is made, I'm ok, otherwise I might puke. I have no vegetarians in my family so this little issue that I have confuses them.

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## Jovialis

> You'll be able to compare it to your results at 23andme, because they do something similar. 
> They told me I was programmed to be less than average weight, and that total caloric intake was the thing to watch, which I do. Thank God it didn't say I should only eat protein, although I love meat and fish and would never give them up, because the corollary would be cut down on carbs. 
> Of course, white sugar, lots of deserts, sodas etc. aren't good for anyone, but there's no way I would want to give up *bread, potatoes, pasta, rice etc.*


Yea, I would never give those up either!

It will be interesting to compare the results once I get them.

There's supposed to 8 different traits the metabolism app will inform me about. It will inform me about some of the ancient ancestry as well; certainly some insight into early farmer ancestry. They will also have an ethnic ancestry app coming down the pike after the metabolism one.

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## davef

What are those 8 traits? I'm interested

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## Jovialis

> What are those 8 traits? I'm interested


Not sure, but I assume some of it will probably talk about lactose tolerance, and the ability to digest wheat and cereals I bet; linking it to ancient ancestry.

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## davef

From what I've been told in another thread, my digestive system is well out of the ordinary, which would make sense to me given that those who have ADHD (such as myself) have very unique digestive tracts and imo may require a specialized diet.

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## Gitte

No, and I don't plan to be either. Why? Because I try (or plan, as I still live with my parents) to eat local and seasonal and if I were vegetarian, that would mean surviving on carrots and cabbages in winter. I try to eat less meat, as I understand the conventional meat industry is very polluting (but so is getting your food from the other end of the world) and we simply don't need the amount of meat that is in this day and age eaten in the western world.

Of course, there are regions in the world where there are plenty of fruits and vegetables all year-round, were eating vegetarian and even vegan is easy and sustainable. But that isn't the case everywhere. There are also many places (deserts and very cold places) where you simply can't find not-animal derived foods (food= something that humans can digest and get nutrients from) so, for the people that live there like the tuareg in the sahara desert and the inuit, living of animal products and particularly meat is the easiest and most sustainable options and their digestive systems are used to that.

Conclusion: eat whatever the **** you want but take care of mother earth, by not consuming too much and making boats and planes travel around the world five times before you get your beloved avocado's.

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## parmesean

I have tried to be a vegetarian but it didn't last long haha. Maybe I will try again some day.

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## LouisPhilippe

No, I am not a vegetarian.

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## Gash

yes, I'm vegan.

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## PT Tagus

No, but I like vegetarian/vegan food.

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## TardisBlue

Nope, and will never be.

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## Angela

> Nope, and will never be.


Me neither, and not just because I love meat. I think eating meat influenced how we developed (big brains for one thing) and I also think our bodies are adapted for it. 

Vegetarianism, and veganism, even more so, is, imo, an artificial life style choice which requires constant vigilance to try and get the proper nutrients. That doesn't mean I think you have to eat a ton of meat or fish, but some of it is good for us.

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## TardisBlue

> Me neither, and not just because I love meat. I think eating meat influenced how we developed (big brains for one thing) and I also think our bodies are adapted for it. 
> 
> Vegetarianism, and veganism, even more so, is, imo, an artificial life style choice which requires constant vigilance to try and get the proper nutrients. That doesn't mean I think you have to eat a ton of meat or fish, but some of it is good for us.


I agree with all the above, especially after reading The Vegetarian Myth by Lierre Keith, a former vegan. I tried vegetarianism years ago (not really actually, because I was still eating meat once in a while), but it didn't agree with me. I need meat to function properly. Vegetarianism is not as bad as veganism though. Some of the most extreme vegans even refuse to eat honey…

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## Gash

> I agree with all the above, especially after reading *The Vegetarian Myth by Lierre Keith, a* former vegan. I tried vegetarianism years ago (not really actually, because I was still eating meat once in a while), but it didn't agree with me. I need meat to function properly. Vegetarianism is not as bad as veganism though. Some of the most extreme vegans even refuse to eat honey…









What did you eat as a vegetarian ? there is a difference between vegan and vegetarian though.

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## TardisBlue

> What did you eat as a vegetarian ? there is a difference between vegan and vegetarian though.


I ate eggs, so-called "healthy" whole grains, veggies and fruit. Some dairy. Not eating meat doesn't agree with me, full stop. I respect others' free will to choose what diet is best for them. I expect others to do the same for me.

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## Gash

> I ate eggs, so-called "healthy" whole grains, veggies and fruit. Some dairy. Not eating meat doesn't agree with me, full stop. I respect others' free will to choose what diet is best for them. I expect others to do the same for me.


I do respect others dietary choice of course even though I have met many meat eaters that had a problem with me being vegan. But I noticed most people who have claimed to be vegan usually have done something wrong in the process. 

Vegan and vegetarian arent the same thing. Vegans eat no animal products at all while vegetarians do eat eggs, dairy and stuff like that. 

The author of that book you mentioned was never a vegan but more like a vegetarian, she consumed eggs, dairy cheese and various other animal products. 

Then there are those people that do go vegan but have no idea about plant based nutrition or cooking which can be learned through books, articles online and even just youtube videos. These same people end up blaming a ''Vegan'' diet rather than themselves. 

Then there are people that go vegan for the animals and for the environment , many of these people have no idea about plant based nutrition so they end up unhealthy and eat junk food. 

Personally, I became a vegan because I started finding it disgusting to eat meat, especially when I saw the way they were slaughtered, that its a living being with feelings . It just grossed me out. So I started stopping that. Then I watched a video that explained where dairy came from, how it is actually not meant for human consumption but rather for baby calves, how we take this milk from them and slaughter their calves, and I was absolutely disgusted so I stopped that too. There I was , had no idea what to eat and I would rather starve to death than to eat something that came from an animal again, so I ate a lot of junk that had no animal product in it, but then I started picking up these books on healthy plant based nutrition , read articles and watched videos and I started learning a lot. I realised we dont even need animal products to be healthy and thrive , it is a huge myth. I also realised the food is absolutely delicious. The better cook you become the more delicious. It opened a whole new world. 

Now veganism has become much more to me, I am also contributing to not kill animals or other living beings. I am contributing to not mess up our planet as animal agriculture is destroying it. While at the same time I can be healthy and fit. 


I believe a plant based diet is the healthiest diet, the so called Meditarrean diet is almost like a vegan or plant based diet and the people from Southern Europe that consumed such a diet were shown to be healthier than people that consumed more animal based diet. 

At the end of the day, I respect anyones choice but to this very day I have yet to see a legitimate arguement against veganism. Its usually based on misconceptions and that we developed to eat meat is a myth. Our earlier ancestors were actually plant eaters.

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## davef

Meat is ok when you don't have to chew it 50 times. I don't enjoy meat that's super tough and lacking in taste. White meat from chicken breasts and pork is so incredibly boring and tedious on par with chewing a flavorless stick of gum

Processed meats like baloney, ham, hot dogs, and ground beef for cheeseburgers and chili? Best ever!

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## Angela

Hominids were always on the verge of extinction. They couldn't afford such qualms of conscience. They ate anything and everything digestible. That's actually been true up until very recent times. 

In terms of meat, hominids began eating it 2.6 million years ago.
https://www.nature.com/scitable/know...mans-103874273

Macronutrients from meat are extremely important, and before the easy transport of different kinds of plant foods from one area to another it would have been very difficult for hominids and even humans of prior areas to substitute certain plant foods or combinations of them to get those macronutrients.

"According to this hypothesis, the micronutrients gained from meat are so important that even small scraps of meat are worth the very high energy expenditure that cooperative hunting entails. Important components of meat include not only vitamins A and K, calcium, sodium, and potassium, but also iron, zinc, vitamin B6, and vitamin B12; the latter, although necessary for a balanced primate diet, is present only in small quantities in plants. In addition, macronutrients such as fat and protein, hard to come by in the environments where chimpanzees live, may be important dietary components of meat-eating."

The article also traces the fossil record and artifacts to show the age of the practice.
https://www.americanscientist.org/article/meat-eating-among-the-earliest-humans

Our gut system evolved into one suited for meat eaters.
"It seems that our bodies had to adjust gradually, first getting hooked on seeds and nuts, which are rich in fats but poor in fiber. If our ancestors ate a lot of them, such a diet would have encouraged the growth of the small intestine (where the digestion of lipids takes place) and the shrinking of the caecum (where fibers are digested). This would have made our guts better for processing meat. A seed-and-nut diet could have prepared our ancestors for a carnivorous lifestyle in another way, too: It could have given them the tools for carving carcasses. Some researchers suggest that the simple stone tools used for pounding seeds and nuts could have easily been reassigned to cracking animal bones and cutting off chunks of flesh. And so, by 2.5 million years ago, our ancestors were ready for meat: They had the tools to get it and the bodies to digest it.But being capable is one thing; having the will and skill to go out and get meat is quite another. So what inspired our ancestors to look at antelopes and hippos as potential dinners? The answer, or at least a part of it, may lie in a change of climate approximately 2.5 million years ago. As the rains became less abundant, so did the fruits, leaves, and flowers that our ancestors relied on. Much of the rain forest turned into sparsely wooded grasslands, with few high-quality plants to eat but with more and more grazing animals. During the long, dry spell from January through April, our ancestors would have had problems getting enough food, and to find their usual fare, they would have had to expend more time and calories. Early _hominins_ were at an evolutionary crossroads. Some, like the _australopiths_, chose to eat large quantities of lower-quality plants; others, like early _Homo_, went for meat. The australopiths ended up extinct, but early _Homo_survived to evolve into modern humans."
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/...eaters/463305/

Now, if people, for reasons of conscience or anything else, no longer wish to consume meat, that's of course their choice, but the facts are the facts.

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## Megalophias

> Then I watched a video that explained where dairy came from, how it is actually not meant for human consumption but rather for baby calves, how we take this milk from them and slaughter their calves, and I was absolutely disgusted so I stopped that too.


I totally respect not wanting to kill (higher) animals. That's all that's needed to justify being a vegan. Nothing but human milk is *meant* to be eaten by humans (unless you count domesticates!). Cow milk is intended to be highly nourishing for mammals closely related to us. Nutritious plant foods are either cheap (carbon not nitrogen) bribes to spread seed (fruit) or the plant's energy storage reserves (mostly seeds and roots/tubers) which are most definitely not intended for animals and are commonly defended with poison. But humans are absolutely omnivores and have always eaten everything we can get our hands on. Mammals are generally at least somewhat omnivorous: I recently saw a study tracking wolves in Voyageur National Park, where it seems they spend the summer months gorging on blueberries. And at our local bird sanctuary when they catch birds in nets for banding if they have to be careful not to leave them too long unattended, as the deer will eat them.

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## davef

Just tell the vegans you killed the cow/pig/chicken in self defense

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## Gash

> Hominids were always on the verge of extinction. They couldn't afford such qualms of conscience. They ate anything and everything digestible. That's actually been true up until very recent times.


Earliest ancestors of humans and even most of our ancestors thousands of years ago were mostly plant eaters. Meat was rare in many cultures. Humans mostly ate meat for survival but it isn't a neccessity in this day and age nor do we need it for survival anymore. They had to hunt for meat and didn't eat as much meat as is eaten today in no way. Because we once ate meat for survival or ate anything and everything doesn't justify to eat it today. When it's not needed. When you also look at other apes, they are mostly plant eaters. Not to mention the fact that agriculture in this day and age is destroying our planet as we are also consuming more meat than ever. Our ancestors did not live this way. 




> Macronutrients from meat are extremely important, and before the easy transport of different kinds of plant foods from one area to another it would have been very difficult for hominids and even humans of prior areas to substitute certain plant foods or combinations of them to get those macronutrients."According to this hypothesis, the micronutrients gained from meat are so important that even small scraps of meat are worth the very high energy expenditure that cooperative hunting entails. Important components of meat include not only vitamins A and K, calcium, sodium, and potassium, but also iron, zinc, vitamin B6, and vitamin B12; the latter, although necessary for a balanced primate diet, is present only in small quantities in plants. In addition, macronutrients such as fat and protein, hard to come by in the environments where chimpanzees live, may be important dietary components of meat-eating."


All those nutrients can easily be found in plants and are not even made naturally by animals. Those very animals have absorbed those vitamins and nutrients from the plants they have eaten or their diet. Vitamin B12 isn't naturally produced by animals but rather is found in soil which the animals pick up. This is why many meat eaters are Vitamin B12 deficient. Vitamin B12 can be found in other sources or you could take it as a supplement. Many meat eaters are also vitamin D deficient and folate deficient This is why you also see many meat eaters and animal eaters take supplements. Protein can easily be found in beans and many other plant foods and is actually a much healthier source of protein than from meat, protein from meat is actually cancer promoting while protein from plants is rather the opposite. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/N...es/PMC5963616/

Also showed fat from animals as unhealthy. There are plenty of other studies. Now I have seen ''studies'' that try to argue against this by claiming meat containts nurtients , all those nutrients can be found in plants , these nurtients have been picked up from plants by the animals. Doesn't make actual meat healthy, protein in meat is unhealthy, it also containts unhealthy fat and high cholestorol. 

Calcium can be found in plants and is actually much healthier than the calcium you would recieve from milk from another mammal which isn't even meant for a human to consume in the first place but actually for the mammals baby. In the same way it would be dumb to take milk from the breast of a human woman and sell it in stores instead of giving it to her baby. Fat can be found in seeds. 

You also forgot how meat totally lacks fiber which is only found in plant foods and is important to human health. You also forgot how meat consumption and dairy are linked to increase rates of cancer and various other diseases. 

Meat is classified as a type 1 carcogenic food by the world health organization. Which means that it is a toxic food , pretty much. Except for B12 which can be found naturally in soil or from a supplement, a correct plant based diet containts much more nutrients than an animal based diet pretty much and can get you all the nurtients you need if done correctly. 

Even WHFoods lists a Vegan diet as healthier

http://whfoods.org/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=363





> Our gut system evolved into one suited for meat eaters."It seems that our bodies had to adjust gradually, first getting hooked on seeds and nuts, which are rich in fats but poor in fiber. If our ancestors ate a lot of them, such a diet would have encouraged the growth of the small intestine (where the digestion of lipids takes place) and the shrinking of the caecum (where fibers are digested). This would have made our guts better for processing meat. A seed-and-nut diet could have prepared our ancestors for a carnivorous lifestyle in another way, too: It could have given them the tools for carving carcasses. Some researchers suggest that the simple stone tools used for pounding seeds and nuts could have easily been reassigned to cracking animal bones and cutting off chunks of flesh. And so, by 2.5 million years ago, our ancestors were ready for meat: They had the tools to get it and the bodies to digest it.But being capable is one thing; having the will and skill to go out and get meat is quite another. So what inspired our ancestors to look at antelopes and hippos as potential dinners? The answer, or at least a part of it, may lie in a change of climate approximately 2.5 million years ago. As the rains became less abundant, so did the fruits, leaves, and flowers that our ancestors relied on. Much of the rain forest turned into sparsely wooded grasslands, with few high-quality plants to eat but with more and more grazing animals. During the long, dry spell from January through April, our ancestors would have had problems getting enough food, and to find their usual fare, they would have had to expend more time and calories. Early hominins were at an evolutionary crossroads. Some, like the australopiths, chose to eat large quantities of lower-quality plants; others, like early Homo, went for meat. The australopiths ended up extinct, but early Homosurvived to evolve into modern humans."https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2016/02/when-humans-became-meateaters/463305/


Yes , this was mostly for survival reasons, as the article says at a time during climate change but we didn't actually evovle to eat it nor do we need it for survival today. The article says basically they had to eat it to survive because they had no access to other foods due to a climate change. And we had to hunt for it and didn't have it easily available which means in most cases we still chose easier available plants. 

We don't need it to survive today. Throughout most of history we were still plant eaters and we grew and cultivated plant foods. Meat Eating was adopted during time of surivival when it was needed, as the article says. This climate change only affected parts of the globe and only certain humans and which is why you see also apes never died off despite being mostly plant eaters. They are also actually physically stronger than humans. 

Truth is , our ancestors didn't eat nearly as much meat as we eat today nor is it needed today for survival normismit really justified.

The article isn't saying we need meat, it is actually admitting that our ancestors were plant eaters but at one point some of them had to eat meat in some parts of the globe in order to survive through a certain period of time, this doesn't mean that throughout most human history we only ate meat or ate heavily meat or that we need it for survival in general. We still ate plants and cultivated plant foods and in most cases was easier available since we had to hunt for meat. 

Our gut system hasn't really evolved to eating meat nor is eating meat supposedly healthy for our gut system. 

This study actually found Vegans had a healthier gut than meat eaters as Vegans also had less inflammation

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4245565/

Not only that, but they found these Vegans had also other incredible health benefits compared to meat eaters which I can't bother to qoute so you can just click the link and read. 




> Now, if people, for reasons of conscience or anything else, no longer wish to consume meat, that's of course their choice, but the facts are the facts.


The facts are animal agriculture is destroying our planet , we don't need meat to survive, we are also breeding animals into existence and enslaving them when it isnt even needed. 

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...y-amis-cameron

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envi...eat_production


Meat and dairy industry are also propgandists and money making scammers , its a billion dollar industry, basically like a mob. 

Facts are facts.

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## Angela

You either didn't read or didn't understand the links. Your body is adapted to meat eating. That's how it evolved. It functions better with a little meat and fish and eggs. You are so concerned for the environment, but don't realize or acknowledge that in order to provide you with all that variety of plant material twelve months a year gas guzzling planes and trucks pollute the atmosphere. If you wear plastic shoes, that process pollutes the environment too. No matter. 

It's very simple: eat what you want. I couldn't care less. Just stop propagandizing and putting down other people's choices. 

It's just so typical of this era. Totalitarians of every variety are proliferating like mushrooms after a rainstorm.

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## Gash



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## Gash

> You either didn't read or didn't understand the links. Your body is adapted to meat eating. That's how it evolved. It functions better with a little meat and fish and eggs. You are so concerned for the environment, but don't realize or acknowledge that in order to provide you with all that variety of plant material twelve months a year gas guzzling planes and trucks pollute the atmosphere. If you wear plastic shoes, that process pollutes the environment too. No matter. 
> 
> It's very simple: eat what you want. I couldn't care less. Just stop propagandizing and putting down other people's choices. 
> 
> It's just so typical of this era. Totalitarians of every variety are proliferating like mushrooms after a rainstorm.



I did read the part you qouted. I should of kept it shorter. Felt like too much babbling. And we didn't evolve to eat meat. We adopted it at one point when we had to survive. This doesn't make us meat eaters. 

A little meat and egg isn't the same as meat and egg everyday. And no it doesn't function better, you can get all the nutrients from plants without harming or killing other beings. You clearly didn't read the studies that show this. Meat and animal products are shown to cause inflammation in the human body. We are far from meat eaters. 

Because planes , trucks and plastic pollute our environment doesn't justify to enslave and kill other living beings when it's not needed. 

Your taste buds aren't worth more than the life of an animal. 

You should maybe take a trip to a slaughterhouse, workers there suffer from PTSD. 










You can eat whatever you want, at the end of the day it's still your choice , but facts are the facts. 

In reality you're just buying a product that somebody else has slaughtered. 





Btw, I think the admin should make a thumb button so it shows who it is that has clicked it , less likely to get abused. As I did not thumb down your post.

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## 1claire

I am not a vegetarian but there are times wherein I try not to consume meat as I want to lose weight.

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## Craigston

Vegetarianism is one of the most stupid things ever created. I don't know who was the first creator of this madness but he had a mental illness.

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## Héloïse

I'm not but I don't eat a lot of meat

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## morris

nope because meat is good

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## Angela

Damn! This is comedy gold. :) I wish they had put English subtitles, though. 

Let's just say the majority are not of the "if it makes you happy, it makes me happy". This would have been my husband's nonna Anna's reaction precisely! :) God help you.

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## Joker

I'm Vegan, mostly.

Saves a ton of money and is the quickest route to weight-loss.
Very hard to be strict Vegan 100% of the time, friends offer me a sandwich, or when I eat-out, I will break from Veganism.
When I tell people I'm Vegan they automatically assume my politics are far left and that I'm a Dem/environmentalist/animal rights activist...

I'm not a leftist and resent that the left has hijacked food choices with their politics.
Veganism can give you weight-loss like no other food choices and also lower your cholesterol/blood sugar to normal levels in record time.

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## Faunus

I try very often but I always fail.

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## coolfrenchguy

i'am vegan since around 15 years at least maybe more i became progressively and i want don't change i have earn 24% at least of less mortality risks maybe more

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## RoeGriffin

No, I love meat

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## MarkSabier14

I'm not vegetarian and I don't ever plan to, (not that I have anything against vegans or vegetarians, I'm engaged to a vegetarian) but I do think Americans eat waaay more meat than they need to.

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## Angela

> I'm not vegetarian and I don't ever plan to, (not that I have anything against vegans or vegetarians, I'm engaged to a vegetarian) but I do think Americans eat waaay more meat than they need to.


No, and never would, and I actually think it's one of those stupid new-agey ideas for which there's no scientific foundation.

We're descended from meat eaters, and actually perhaps the mainstream conclusion is that it was the abundant protein and animal fat which fueled brain growth. 

Even our digestive system is specifically designed to digest both plants and animals (we have long intestines, which are needed for digesting animal protein ).

Just recently a paper came out that had studied the diet of most Indians, and found that they need at least a 20% increase in animal or fish protein, and that was an Indian paper if I recall correctly.

I've seen where some idiot parents have their babies on no animal protein diets and they were brought to court because the babies weren't developing properly. They should go to jail, just like the similarly idiotic anti-vaxxers.

They really want to go back to a world where some infants routinely die of diphtheria, like some of my relatives from the early 20th century??? 

This doesn't, of course, mean that I think it's healthy to eat steak every night. Moderation in all things, as the Greeks said, and eat whole foods, not processed food. Potato chips are vegetarian, so are most crisps, and ice cream etc.

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## Mmiikkii

I won't be vegetarian, let alone vegan.

I don't think that plants can provide you with the same amount of fats and proteins than animals(closer genetically and in energy needs) do.

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## Doggerland

If you are living in the EU and you buy meat from a supermarket, this meat will be from vegan feed animals.
Since the BSE crisis(Mad Cow Disease) in the late 90s it is forbidden to feed animal protein to the majority of farm animals like pigs, cows, sheep, chickens and turkeys in the EU. It is only allowed for fish and other predators.
The industrial animal foods on the market are all vegan and based on pea, wheat, lupin or soy protein. They where enriched with lab produced amino acids and vitamins, to secure the health of the animals. 
The breeding works well and humanity should be already dead, if this feeders would do harm to the animals or reduce their fertility. They don’t harm the animals or their fertility at all.

There is no reason why primates like humans should not do well on a vegan diet with supplements like other omnivores like pigs or chickens. The food for rats and mice in the animal testing labs is also vegan based and they do well with it.
If it would harm their offspring, this would be a big problem for the animal testing industry.

Humans are descended from primates that ate rough plant matter(leaves), sometimes they hunted other small primates, insects and game animals. With the conquest of the grassland, they evolved to a more meat, root and grain based diet, those things are more energy rich and easier to digest, that reduced the size of their digestive tract over time.

I was vegetarian and vegan some years in my life as I was young, I never had any malnutrition, but I always adhered to the recommendations by doctors about those lifestyles.

The real problem is that you can live on a vegetarian diet with eggs and milk products without any harm, but this produces male baby animals that have no use. You don’t need roosters for eggs, no bulls and bucks for milk, but they will be born. In the past bulls where castrated to work as ox on the fields, but they where replaced by tractors. So why don’t eat them?

On a vegan diet you need a factory to produce vitamin b12 and amino acids to ensure a healthy diet, but in a modern country this is much more efficient than raising animals.
But when you live on a farm and have your own piece of land like me, or you live in a development country, raising animals is the better way.

Veganismin Germany is mostly practiced by two political groups: The far left and the far right. Some few people are interested because of health benefits or because they have a disease like gout, metabolic syndrome or kidney stones.

For the left it is associated with animal rights and anti-speciesism, this is an ideology which compares animals to humans in a sense of their lives value. They want to forbid people to eat meat. It is a duty for a leftist not to harm animals, because they are a marginalized minority and are oppressed by humanity. They are against every form of breeding, selling and raising animals, like the radical animals rights organization PETA.

For the right it is associated with spiritual growth and strength, some Nazi leaders where also vegetarians, because they had greater compassion for animals then for humans. On the spiritual side it is believed that only the Untermensch needs meat. The higher a human being is spiritually evolved, the lesser it needs food. In the end he only needs light from the sun and is a Sonnenmensch(Sun Man) There where cases where adult people fasted to death that where linked to spiritual cults all over the world.
In German vegetarian means Vegetarier/Veget-Arier. One could say the Vegetable Aryan. 
From this ideology, the cases of children and babies died from vegan diets arose. They believe, that they don’t need the nutrients that are recommended to practice a healthy vegan diet and only eat natural, unprocessed food. But they don’t contain all the needed nutrients for humans/omnivores.

My personal reason for becoming vegetarian and vegan in my youth was curiosity and interest for Hindu and Buddhist philosophy. There where also much media propaganda about the health benefits. 20 years later there seem to be still some benefits for a meat reduced or vegetarian diet when it comes to some diseases when one is looking at actual studies. Lesser uric acid, lesser cholesterol, lesser colon cancer, lesser overall heart disease.

I am not vegetarian or vegan anymore, because of my lifestyle. I breed, sell and slaughter animals and I don’t see any reason to stop this, this is also part of the cultural life in my region and part of social activities.

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## kile

I respect people that go vegan for their health, but those that do it to save animals, I have no respect for. The rise of vegetarianism shows how we moved far from nature. People today apply human standards to non-humans. Oh my god, that little piggie gets killed, ohhh noo. Had a conversation with an acquitance and I asked him if he was stranded with his wife and a kid of their own on a desert island, would he kill an animal to feed his family. The answer was no. That was absolutely disgusting to me. I would respect him more if he recited Das Kapital or sang Death to all Croats. I really would. For I can understand someone to hate me, but I can't understand without disgust putting an animal before your own family. It requires great strives to be able to do that, to fight an innate value of utmost priority to protect your own family. No justification for it.

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## firetown

I firmly believe that nature also gave us the right cravings to help us get proper nutrition.
Of course, food flavors are being manipulated to have you crave items you otherwise wouldn't.
It's not the chips you crave, but the artificial flavor.
So if you crave the onion flavor, buy some onions.
Eat fresh and natural and follow your cravings.
Eliminate "taste manipulation" and let nature guide you...
be it to meat or not meat.
However... I bet that you will crave meat. At least here and there.
If you try to fight nature...


... nature fights back:

https://www.instagram.com/p/B5gqhFmDfx_/?hl=en

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## firetown

> I respect people that go vegan for their health, .


I don't



> but those that do it to save animals, I have no respect for.


Actually...
https://twitter.com/SBakerMD/status/1509180685004664840

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## firetown

> I am not a vegetarian but there are times wherein I try not to consume meat as I want to lose weight.


Do you eat bread, pasta, pizza, chips...?
From what I understand, manmade high-carb food products such as those (vs. natural like rice, potatoes) have very little nutritional value creating a carb overload leading to high weight gain unless you are physically very active.
Your body can literally be starving for the right types of food while you gain weight.

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## PaleoRevenge

> I firmly believe that nature also gave us the right cravings to help us get proper nutrition.
> Of course, food flavors are being manipulated to have you crave items you otherwise wouldn't.
> It's not the chips you crave, but the artificial flavor.
> So if you crave the onion flavor, buy some onions.
> Eat fresh and natural and follow your cravings.
> Eliminate "taste manipulation" and let nature guide you...
> be it to meat or not meat.
> However... I bet that you will crave meat. At least here and there.
> If you try to fight nature...
> ...



Spot on. I don't write long nonsense essays. Here is the deal people, there is this thing called genetic code. This infrastructure has given you senses and cravings. Just like you use your eyes to see, you need to use your tongue to taste. There are some vegetarians that wrote a ginormous post on why vegetarian is feasible blah blah. Let your body be the judge, eat a high quality steak with the fat then let your senses decide. Your genetic code has millions of years of evolution behind it, the instincts are NEVER wrong. 
Your gut does not need a giant essay to convince itself to be or not be a vegetarian, it will decide the matter in a snap of a finger with one bite.

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## EV13SON

> I respect people that go vegan for their health, but those that do it to save animals, I have no respect for. The rise of vegetarianism shows how we moved far from nature. People today apply human standards to non-humans. Oh my god, that little piggie gets killed, ohhh noo. Had a conversation with an acquitance and I asked him if he was stranded with his wife and a kid of their own on a desert island, would he kill an animal to feed his family. The answer was no. That was absolutely disgusting to me. I would respect him more if he recited Das Kapital or sang Death to all Croats. I really would. For I can understand someone to hate me, but I can't understand without disgust putting an animal before your own family. It requires great strives to be able to do that, to fight an innate value of utmost priority to protect your own family. No justification for it.


Well I slightly differ I'm no vegetarian, if you have any Argentinian roots and are a vegetarian you might as well turn in your Argentinian card. But what I don't like about todays industry are these large animal factories that completely destroy the landscape and have a complete disregard for the environment. I'm no hippie myself but I do respect those hippies that choose to be vegetarian to help the environment. I would much rather it be like the old days were food is sourced locally in small family owned ranches...the commercialization of ranching is kind of a dystopian example of todays greed...Now I'm also not for everyone to become a vegetarian because if you want to protect the animals and no one is eating them, why raise them at all? So I'm with you there.

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## firetown

> Spot on. I don't write long nonsense essays. Here is the deal people, there is this thing called genetic code. This infrastructure has given you senses and cravings. Just like you use your eyes to see, you need to use your tongue to taste. There are some vegetarians that wrote a ginormous post on why vegetarian is feasible blah blah. Let your body be the judge, eat a high quality steak with the fat then let your senses decide. Your genetic code has millions of years of evolution behind it, the instincts are NEVER wrong. 
> Your gut does not need a giant essay to convince itself to be or not be a vegetarian, it will decide the matter in a snap of a finger with one bite.


Thank you and likewise.

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## Eric Jenkins

I have been a vegetarian for 4 years.

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## Olivia_19

> I have been a vegetarian for 4 years.


oh yeah, me too

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## Asil

Im an ex vegeterian

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