# Population Genetics > Autosomal Genetics >  Albanian Autosomal DNA

## Luan

I have read a lot on here about Albanian origin and DNA with no sources or Science proof. I did a FTDNA Family Finder Autosomal test, and my result came out as
80% South East Europe- Tuscan
20% Europe- Basque, Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Spanish

I also Had my result looked at by Dr. Douglas McDonald his result were
Most likely fit is 11.1% Europe(Various subcontienents)
and 88.9% Europe All south European(Tuscan)
which is total 100%Europe.

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## gashi91

I have done a FTDNA Family Finder test myself. I will post my results on this page as soon as they're out.

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## Luan

> I have done a FTDNA Family Finder test myself. I will post my results on this page as soon as they're out.


Looking forward to seeing your results.

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## Albania

I have my results 09/06....urime..

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## Albania

Mund ta shohim si faqe ..per kuriozitet duke pritur tonat ?

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## Luan

> Mund ta shohim si faqe ..per kuriozitet duke pritur tonat ?



I think its best to write in english so others can read.

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## Albania

> I think its best to write in english so others can read.


 Can we look your results page ..(curiosity), waiting for our results, thank you .. :Good Job:

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## Luan

> Can we look your results page ..(curiosity), waiting for our results, thank you ..


Check inbox. From were Albania are you from?

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## gashi91

Uten navn.jpg

Europe
Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Russian
23.20%


Europe (Southern European)
Tuscan
76.80%



So I got my final results. All European

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## Luan

> Uten navn.jpg
> 
> Europe
> Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Russian
> 23.20%
> 
> 
> Europe (Southern European)
> Tuscan
> ...


It seem that Albanian score high on Tuscan. Very good.

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## gashi91

> It seem that Albanian score high on Tuscan. Very good.


What would this eventually tell us? 

Who are these Tuscan?

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## kamani

> Who are these Tuscan?


Theoretically, descendants of Etruscans. People try to link them with Pelasgians. Read about Lemnos Steele.

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## zanipolo

> Theoretically, descendants of Etruscans. People try to link them with Pelasgians. Read about Lemnos Steele.


are you saying Albanians where proto-tuscans or ?

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## kamani

> are you saying Albanians where proto-tuscans or ?


Today there is only distant connections. Proto-Etruscan connects with Pelasgian. Gheg Albanians are natives who found refuge from invasions in the Mountains, so I would expect Ghegs to score high on Tuscan. I would expect Tosks to have some French/German percentage, with the IE-Albanian-speaking elite coming from central-Europe.

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## Eldritch

I wonder is it normal for Albanians scoring so high Tuscan?

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## zanipolo

> It seem that Albanian score high on Tuscan. Very good.


You do know that this FTDNA PF test has for italy and the balkans has only 4 names. FOUR NAMES FOR SOUTHEAST EUROPE
they are 

*Sardinian* = Sardinia and Corsica
*Romanian* = Romanian and Bulgaria
*Italian* = south Italy, Albania and Greece
*Tuscan* = central Italy, north Italy and old Yugoslavian lands

there really is *no choice*, besides its in Beta stage.

DNATribes ( which NatGeno use ) has Albania, south Italy and Greece under the term *GREEK*

If you want something better, place your gedcom in gedmatch and one of the other 4 autosomal companies....even these are not accurate.
or better , get your chromosome painting checked by an expert for ancestry

below ..all FTDNA PF

Europe


Northeast European



Finnish



Russian


Southeast European



Romanian


Southern European



Italian



Sardinian



Tuscan


Western European



Basque



French



Orcadian (Orkney Islands)



Spanish

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## zanipolo

> I wonder is it normal for Albanians scoring so high Tuscan?


most likely he is old Montenegrin, Bosnian or Serb area...then again PF tests from FTDNA are still in beta stage

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## Luan

> You do know that this FTDNA PF test has for italy and the balkans has only 4 names. FOUR NAMES FOR SOUTHEAST EUROPE
> they are 
> 
> *Sardinian* = Sardinia and Corsica
> *Romanian* = Romanian and Bulgaria
> *Italian* = south Italy, Albania and Greece
> *Tuscan* = central Italy, north Italy and old Yugoslavian lands
> 
> there really is *no choice*, besides its in Beta stage.
> ...


Yes i know this is family finder, i stated that in my first post. And i had my result looked at by an expert, dr. Mcdonald.

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## Luan

> most likely he is old Montenegrin, Bosnian or Serb area...then again PF tests from FTDNA are still in beta stage


If you are refering to me, I am of kosovo old dardania area.

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## zanipolo

> Yes i know this is family finder, i stated that in my first post. And i had my result looked at by an expert, dr. Mcdonald.


Great, what did he give you for your bar chart and pin placing for ethnicity. ( i placed mine in this forum...I think it was the autosomal thread)
I guess his comments where well received.

As for you being dardanian, fantastic, then you are original ancient race, they fled into the albanian mountains after being attacked on 3 sides, by thracians, illyrians and macedonians all for that fertile land.

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## Eldritch

I agree with Zanipolo, it would be very interesting to see where McDonalds places you in the map and also your Gedmatch scores.

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## kamani

> You do know that this FTDNA PF test has for italy and the balkans has only 4 names. FOUR NAMES FOR SOUTHEAST EUROPE
> they are 
> 
> *Sardinian* = Sardinia and Corsica
> *Romanian* = Romanian and Bulgaria
> *Italian* = south Italy, Albania and Greece
> *Tuscan* = central Italy, north Italy and old Yugoslavian lands
> 
> there really is *no choice*, besides its in Beta stage.


If that is the case, then I guess this test would provide little evidence of pelasgian origin, since "tuscan" is such a general classification for so many people. I guess we have to let the ghegs be also Illyrian, not just pelasgian.

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## Luan

> Great, what did he give you for your bar chart and pin placing for ethnicity. ( i placed mine in this forum...I think it was the autosomal thread)
> I guess his comments where well received.
> 
> As for you being dardanian, fantastic, then you are original ancient race, they fled into the albanian mountains after being attacked on 3 sides, by thracians, illyrians and macedonians all for that fertile land.


He gave me chart i dont know if i still have them in my mail, but the chart with the brightest color was in the north east italy. I will look in my mail again.

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## Eldritch

> He gave me chart i dont know if i still have them in my mail, but the chart with the brightest color was in the north east italy. I will look in my mail again.


You can also try GedMatch calculators.

And if you find the chart post it here.

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## Albania

E12439 for autosomal-O36-results.csv.

Most likely fit is 100% Tuscan (Southern Europe)
that is 100% Total Europe
The localization error = 0.005525 with one group

The following are the possible populations
probably at the top:
Tuscan = 1.000

and in fact, seems very nearly correct.

Doug McDonald

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## Albania

But FTDNA 80 % French,orcadian,tuscan 20% M.East margin error 23 %

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## Eldritch

Albania which are the population fits McDonald gave to you?

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## zanipolo

> But FTDNA 80 % French,orcadian,tuscan 20% M.East margin error 23 %


I thought the ftdna info stated that over 15% error, the information is likely to be wrong

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## Albania

> Albania which are the population fits McDonald gave to you?


i am sorry i dont see 1 list..

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## Eldritch

> i am sorry i dont see 1 list..


That's very strange, email him again, he gives the fit to anyone.

Maybe he forgot!

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## LumiBardha

they are from the same region for thousands of years it actually makes sense for them to have common dna

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## LumiBardha

I am Albanian from Montenegro

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## LumiBardha

I feel like there is not enough talk about Albanians from this region because there aren't that many

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## LumiBardha

I took the ancestry dna test because I was just curious what it would show. they seem to have the same problem of grouping all this southeastern Europeans together. However I brought my raw dna over to gedmatch and rolled my dna into eurgenes k13 and dodcad world 9

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## LumiBardha

now that I have my 10th post I can display the results

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## LumiBardha

*Population*
*Percent*

1
Atlantic_Baltic
54.1

2
Southern
26.16

3
Caucasus_Gedrosia
18.72

4
Siberian
0.73

5
African
0.13

6
East_Asian
0.1

7
Amerindian
0.06



*Single Population Sharing:*

*#*
*Population (source)*
*Distance*

1
Bulgarians (Yunusbayev)
3.9

2
Bulgarian (Dodecad)
4.12

3
N_Italian (Dodecad)
4.29

4
North_Italian (HGDP)
5.48




*Primary Population (source)*
*Secondary Population (source)*
*Distance*

1

72.1%
C_Italian (Dodecad)
 + 
27.9%
 Swedish (Dodecad)
 @ 
0.58

2

51.2%
 Greek (Dodecad)
 + 
48.8%
 French (HGDP)
 @ 
0.61

3

90.6%
 N_Italian (Dodecad)
 + 
9.4%
 Chechens (Yunusbayev)
 @ 
0.63

4

78.1%
 Tuscan (HGDP)
 + 
21.9%
 Ukranians (Yunusbayev)
 @ 
0.63

5

91.1%
 N_Italian (Dodecad)
 + 
8.9%
 Lezgins (Behar)
 @ 
0.65




*Admix Results (sorted):

**#*
*Population*
*Percent*

1
North_Atlantic
26.38

2
East_Med
20.75

3
Baltic
20.56

4
West_Med
18.98

5
West_Asian
8.25

6
Red_Sea
3.58

7
Northeast_African
0.67

8
Amerindian
0.61

9
East_Asian
0.22



*Single Population Sharing:*

*#*
*Population (source)*
*Distance*

1
Romanian
5.78

2
Bulgarian
6.33

3
Serbian
8.2

4
Greek_Thessaly
9.13



*Primary Population (source)*
*Secondary Population (source)*
*Distance*

1

72.6%
 Tuscan
 + 
27.4%
 Southwest_Russian
@ 
1.83

2

72.9%
 Tuscan
 + 
27.1%
 Ukrainian_Belgorod
 @ 
1.84

3

57.5%
 Serbian
 + 
42.5%
 Tuscan
 @ 
2.05


The second list is euro k13, the first is world 9

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## Eldritch

> *Population*
> *Percent*
> 
> 1
> Atlantic_Baltic
> 54.1
> 
> 2
> Southern
> ...


Interesting, so do Albanians from your area cluster with North Italians and Bulgarians?
Usually they cluster with Tuscans from what i' ve seen.

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## LumiBardha

I think there just isn't an option for Albanian. Most likely a possible Slavic mix because I don't ever remember running into any Bulgarians when I would visit my family. Bulgarians are most likely a Thracian mix which means it would make sense given a Thraco-Illyrian connection. As far as Tuscan goes, it's got such a wide range that you can dub anyone in the Balkans somewhat Tuscan genetically.

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## mihaitzateo

> Interesting, so do Albanians from your area cluster with North Italians and Bulgarians?
> Usually they cluster with Tuscans from what i' ve seen.


That means Bulgarians are clustering with North Italians?
I see that on some tests this Albanian is very closed to North Italians,on another test (Single Population Sharing),he is closest to Romanians.

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## Sile

> That means Bulgarians are clustering with North Italians?
> I see that on some tests this Albanian is very closed to North Italians,on another test (Single Population Sharing),he is closest to Romanians.


The Laz paper places - Bulgarians, North-Italians and South-French as basically the same numbers in the EEF-WHG-ANE groupings

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## LumiBardha

I doubt the test has anything to do with Bulgarian or Tuscan. The mix of the two would be closest to what I am. Tuscan is so wide ranging and so is Bulgarian/Romanian to be honest because it is a Slavic mix(12a)? with perhaps EV13.

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## Moor

> I have read a lot on here about Albanian origin and DNA with no sources or Science proof. I did a FTDNA Family Finder Autosomal test, and my result came out as
> 80% South East Europe- Tuscan
> 20% Europe- Basque, Finnish, French, Orcadian, Romanian, Spanish
> 
> I also Had my result looked at by Dr. Douglas McDonald his result were
> Most likely fit is 11.1% Europe(Various subcontienents)
> and 88.9% Europe All south European(Tuscan)
> which is total 100%Europe.


Can you post your plot ? do you plot Near Italy ?

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## Dibran

> Can you post your plot ? do you plot Near Italy ?


Bump

Does this Mr Douglas examine 23andme data or Gedmatch charts?

I don't really understand my results. I'm northern Gheg Albanian yet I plot closely with Tuscans and Greeks. Mainly northern Greece and Thessaly. 

My father moreso to Thessaly and Greece. 

My k36 plot put me off the coast of Spain right in the water. Lol. 

For instance here are some gedmatch tests. 

This first one. Like idk what to make of it. 

Harrapaworld 



Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	Caucasian	30.35
2	Mediterranean	29.62
3	NE-Euro	26.52
4	SW-Asian	8.05
5	Baloch	4.61


Finished reading population data. 377 populations found.
16 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 tuscan @ 3.845267
2 tuscan @ 4.297274
3 tuscan @ 4.908243
4 ashkenazi @ 11.336257
5 italian @ 11.732196
6 bulgarian @ 11.873545
7 romanian-a @ 12.964595
8 ashkenazy-jew @ 14.762963
9 serbian @ 19.669205
10 sephardic-jew @ 21.573978
11 morocco-jew @ 22.207796
12 turk-aydin @ 23.762938
13 spaniard @ 25.116476
14 spaniard @ 26.094967
15 french @ 27.884296
16 hungarian @ 28.513508
17 puerto-rican @ 30.215263
18 slovenian @ 30.218838
19 romanian-b @ 31.005081
20 turk-istanbul @ 31.084003

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% ashkenazi +50% italian @ 3.838477


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% bulgarian +25% druze +25% spain-basc @ 2.799596


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++++++++++++++
1 druze + hungarian + sardinian + serbian @ 1.700702
2 bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan + tuscan @ 1.862400
3 druze + sardinian + serbian + slovenian @ 1.874568
4 ashkenazi + bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan @ 1.900886
5 belorussian + druze + sardinian + tuscan @ 1.987812
6 druze + russian + sardinian + tuscan @ 2.003435
7 belorussian + druze + sardinian + tuscan @ 2.004911
8 ashkenazi + bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.011636
9 belorussian + druze + sardinian + tuscan @ 2.032527
10 bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.036038
11 druze + russian + sardinian + tuscan @ 2.089630
12 ashkenazi + bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.090878
13 druze + romanian-a + sardinian + slovenian @ 2.127053
14 ashkenazi + bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.138832
15 bulgarian + cypriot + italian + italian @ 2.140115
16 bulgarian + druze + sardinian + slovenian @ 2.161041
17 bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.180578
18 druze + russian + sardinian + tuscan @ 2.200967
19 bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.223606
20 ashkenazi + bulgarian + tuscan + tuscan @ 2.230394

Done.

Elapsed time 2.7817 seconds.



MDLP K16 2xOracle and OracleX4

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	Caucasian	34.02
2	Neolithic	32.28
3	NorthEastEuropean	15.52
4	Steppe	15.43
5	NearEast	2.26


Finished reading population data. 516 populations found.
16 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Italian @ 4.375938
2 Kosovar @ 4.947197
3 Greek @ 6.314175
4 Albanian @ 6.578762
5 Italian @ 7.174864
6 Greek @ 7.410804
7 Italian @ 7.430727
8 Macedonian @ 8.117078
9 Corsican @ 8.431943
10 Bulgarian @ 8.542656
11 Greek @ 8.922658
12 Gagauz @ 9.098313
13 Bulgarian @ 9.167999
14 Italian @ 9.309483
15 Romanian @ 9.652543
16 Montenegrian @ 9.747671
17 Italian @ 9.763817
18 Romanian @ 10.264160
19 Serbian @ 10.617203
20 Romanian @ 10.805533

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek +50% Italian @ 3.249501


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek +25% Italian +25% Italian @ 3.249501




Kit Num: M635564

Feel free to run my kit. 

K13 Oracle ref data revised 21 Nov 2013

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	West_Med	27.15
2	East_Med	24.54
3	North_Atlantic	19.43
4	Baltic	16.81
5	West_Asian	10.55
6	Red_Sea	1.52


Finished reading population data. 204 populations found.
13 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Greek_Thessaly @ 7.295632
2 Tuscan @ 11.345535
3 Central_Greek @ 11.814044
4 West_Sicilian @ 11.846689
5 Italian_Abruzzo @ 12.700343
6 Bulgarian @ 12.873500
7 East_Sicilian @ 13.000627
8 North_Italian @ 14.683453
9 Romanian @ 15.138682
10 South_Italian @ 15.256856
11 Ashkenazi @ 16.222134
12 Serbian @ 19.495905
13 Algerian_Jewish @ 21.132277
14 Italian_Jewish @ 21.806252
15 Sephardic_Jewish @ 22.578613
16 Portuguese @ 24.181244
17 Spanish_Extremadura @ 24.213604
18 Spanish_Andalucia @ 24.910484
19 Spanish_Galicia @ 25.158728
20 Spanish_Valencia @ 25.589027

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Thessaly +50% Greek_Thessaly @ 7.295632


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Bulgarian +25% Central_Greek +25% Sardinian @ 3.237620


Using 4 populations approximation:

----------


## LeBrok

In terms of HarappaWorld GedMatch.

Europeans
# of samples
S-Indian
Baloch
Caucasian
NE-Euro
SE-Asian
Siberian
NE-Asian
Papuan
American
Beringian
Mediterranean
SW-Asian
San
E-African
Pygmy
W-African

russian
behar
1%
4%
13%
64%
1%
3%
0%
1%
1%
1%
13%
0%
0%
0%
0%
0%

belorussian
behar
1%
5%
10%
64%
1%
1%
0%
0%
0%
0%
16%
1%
0%
0%
0%
0%

ukranian
yunusbayev
1%
6%
12%
58%
0%
1%
0%
0%
0%
0%
17%
2%
0%
0%
0%
0%

Poland
LeBrok
1
7
10
57
1
1
0
0
0
0
22
1
0
0
0
0

slovenian
xing
1%
6%
15%
51%
0%
0%
0%
0%
0%
0%
23%
3%
0%
0%
0%
0

hungarian
behar
0%
7%
15%
49%
0%
1%
0%
0%
0%
0%
24%
3%
0%
0%
0%
0%

Netherlands
Northerner
0
9
6
55
0
0
0
1
0
0
29
0
0
0
0
0

Italy, NE
7
0
7
20
34
0
0
0
0
0
0
31
6
0
0
0
0

Italy, NW
5
0
6
20
33
0
0
0
0
0
0
34
6
0
0
0
0

Italy, Tuscany
4
0
7
25
28
0
0
0
0
0
0
32
8
0
0
0
0

Italy, South
5
0
8
32
17
0
0
0
0
0
0
27
13
0
1
0
0

Sicily
5
0
9
32
18
0
0
0
0
0
0
27
12
0
1
0
0

Sardinia
2
0
0
23
17
0
0
0
0
0
0
48
11
0
0
0
0

Macedonia
selectivememri
0
6
25
35
0
1
0
0
0
1
25
7
0
0
0
0

Albania
2
0
6
30
26
0
0
0
0
0
0
29
8
0
0
0
0

Greek, mainland
3
0
6
32
25
0
0
0
0
0
0
26
11
0
0
0
0

Greek, Islands, East
5
0
9
38
14
0
0
1
0
0
0
23
14
0
0
0
0

Cyprus
4
1
10
44
6
1
0
0
0
0
0
20
17
0
0
0
0

Ashkenazy
?
1
5
34
19
0
0
1
0
0
0
24
14
0
1
0
0

Turkey
4
1
15
44
11
0
4
3
0
0
1
11
9
0
0
0
0

----------


## Angela

> Bump
> 
> Does this Mr Douglas examine 23andme data or Gedmatch charts?
> 
> I don't really understand my results. *I'm northern Gheg Albanian yet I plot closely with Tuscans and Greeks. Mainly northern Greece and Thessaly. 
> 
> My father moreso to Thessaly and Greece.* 
> 
> My k36 plot put me off the coast of Spain right in the water. Lol. 
> ...


If an Admixture run doesn't include a reference sample for your ethnicity, in your case Gheg Albanian, then the algorithm will look for the next best match. 

It's not unusual for Albanians to get Tuscans and/or Thessaly as their best match if there is no Albanian reference sample. In a run I saw which didn't have either a North Italy or Tuscan sample, I got Bulgarian and then Albanian as my best matches. 

That's all it means. It doesn't mean you're Tuscan or Greek. It just means Albanians are pretty close to them.

----------


## Dibran

> If an Admixture run doesn't include a reference sample for your ethnicity, in your case Gheg Albanian, then the algorithm will look for the next best match. 
> 
> It's not unusual for Albanians to get Tuscans and/or Thessaly as their best match if there is no Albanian reference sample. In a run I saw which didn't have either a North Italy or Tuscan sample, I got Bulgarian and then Albanian as my best matches. 
> 
> That's all it means. It doesn't mean you're Tuscan or Greek. It just means Albanians are pretty close to them.


Ahh. I see. Thank you for the clarification.

----------

