How can IE migration be explained without mentioning Seima Turbino?

[johen]

The Borodino treasure of seima turbino culture in Historical museum, Russia.

Triskele symbol on dagger seems to be connected to china bronze and the celts.
(of course, the above snake-moving mark is related with mycenaean and the celts)

Enlage picture in the link below and see one triskele mark on dagger:
http://nav.shm.ru/upload/iblock/c19/c1905ec5e5641e33c95e1d04b45ebc65.png

[FONT=&quot]american indian homecoming symbol

"The homecoming symbol signified the return of a warrior. A number of ceremonies were held to welcome the brave warriors after the war was over. During festivals, homecoming dances were held for the warriors."

[/FONT]

https://historyplex.com/native-indian-war-paint-symbols-their-meanings[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

 

[johen]

How did sintashta culture survive? Seima turbino people attacked whole eurasia, but sintashta. If sintashta people was strong enough to defend against seima turbino, why were they stuck in east Ural?

Anyway, two people seems to interact each other.

[figure 86. materials from an aristocratic burial at zardcha khalifa in the zeravshan valley. (1) horse-head sceptre pin of bronze of the same type as those found in sintashta (4) [not to scale]. (2) two horse bits of bronze. (3) fragments of cheek-pieces of bone. modified from parpola and carpelan (2005), where images from bobomulloev 1997 and gening et al. 1992 are used.]

horse-head in seima-turbino
http://s155239215.onlinehome.us/turkic/btn_Archeology/Chernykh/Chernykh2008Fig8.jpg

arkaim statue in sintashta culture:
www.ringingcedarsofrussia.org/theearth/oct12/arkaim-8.jpg

same statue in seima at 20:
http://www.sarks.fi/fa/PDF/FA19_13.pdf

according to anthony:
[the dating of the seima-turbino horizon has changed significantly in recent years. similarities between seima-turbino socketed spearheads and daggers and parallel objects in mycenaean tombs were once used to date the seima-turbino horizon to a period after 1650 bce. it is clear now, however, that mycenaean socketed spearheads, like studded disk cheekpieces, were derived from the east and not the other way around. seima-turbino and sintashta were partly contemporary, so seima-turbino probably began before 1900 bce.31 seima-turbino and sintasha graves had the same kinds of flint projectile points. sintashta forged socketed spearheads probably were the simpler predecessors of the more refined hollow-cast seima-turbino socketed spearheads. a hollow-cast spearhead of seima-turbino type was deposited in a petrovka-culture chariot grave at krivoe ozero (k. 2, gr. 1); and a sintashta bent and forged spearhead appeared in the seima-turbino cemetery at rostovka (gr. 1) (see figure 16.15). the metal-working techniques of the northern steppes (sintashta and petrovka) and the forest-steppe zone (seima-turbino) remained separate and distinct for perhaps one hundred to two hundred years. but by the beginning of the andronovo period they merged, and some important seima-turbino metal types, such as cast single-edged knives with a ring-pommel, became widely popular in andronovo communities.]

1. Sintashta outlier WSHG R1a, Q1a and R1b might be seima turbino's Y-Hg like scythian;
Arsenic bronze Sintashta was surrounded by tin bronze seima turbino. However, looks like seima turbino did not touch sintashta even if they butchered the other area. (Q1a china bronze, R1a india, R1b greek)

2. bol'shemysskaya (4th millennium bc, P297 was found) ---> odinovo culture ---> elunino ST culture (Q was found. Its sword was found in erlitou culture and shimao pyramid in china)

[TABLE="width: 435"]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Potapovka_o[/TD]
[TD]R1[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Potapovka[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b2a2a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Central_Steppe_MLBA[/TD]
[TD]Zevakinskiy_BA[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b2a2a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o2[/TD]
[TD]R1b1a1a2a2[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o2[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b2a2a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o1[/TD]
[TD]R1b1a1a2[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o1[/TD]
[TD]Q1a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o1[/TD]
[TD]Q1a2[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG_brother.I1057_brother.I1056[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o2[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG_brother.I1057_brother.I1058[/TD]
[TD]Sintashta_MLBA_o2[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Dali_MLBA[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b2a2a[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steppe_MLBA_oWSHG[/TD]
[TD]Oy_Dzhaylau_MLBA_o[/TD]
[TD]R1a1a1b2a2a[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

P-297:
http://secher.bernard.free.fr/blog/public/2017_Hollard_Tableau14.jpg

 

[johen]

India copper hoard Y crown (up) and Y sword (2,000 -1,500bc)

1. I think leaf and antenna symbolize life tree and deer antler. I think ancient shaman wore it. If they had technology, they would make it like sarmatian diadem below.

2.Why did shaman wear the diadem? I think it is b/c shaman was a king at that time. Priest is the first class Royal in vedic caste system. The priest seems to be shaman, b/c they originated in steppe. Havard scholar K C Chang exactly understood shaman.

in ancient times people could connect with the heavens through the shaman with this heaven and earth connection, those controlling this form of communication had the knowledge and power to rule. therefore, the shaman became an indispensable member at the royal court. in fact, often times the king was actually the leader of the shamans. the founder of china’s first three dynasties possessed shaman and supernatural abilities. for example, xiayu was able to stop and control huge flooding by using mysterious powers of his "pace of yu”, which became an important style for later shamans. another shaman was shang tang of the shang dynasty, could pray to the heavens for rain. furthermore, shaman houji could make his own crops grow and mature faster than others. such traditions have been confirmed in shang dynasty oracles. the oracle bone inscriptions noted: the shang king is the leader of the shamans. according to the inscriptions, the only holder of prophecy rights is shang king. it contained contents of the shang kings performing rain dances and dream interpretations, all of which were both shang king’s and shaman’s activities. this demonstrates that shang kings were indeed shamans. note: kc chang, qingtong huichen

- Moses also veiled himself in front of people after he confronted God.

3. The above shaman holds a drum composed of Circle (sky) and Cross. The Cross symbolizes A flying bird (crow) being a messenger from the Circle of sky or heaven. That is a shaman, a messenger from sky or heaven to connect heaven to earth. Ancient zhou king in China was called as a son of sky/heaven天子 , who thought he got a mandate from sky/ heaven天命.

zhou horse burial:
http://www.chinaknowledge.de/History/Zhou/Images/zhou_chariot3_horses.jpg

scyhtian horse burial:
https://3c1703fe8d.site.internapcdn.net/newman/gfx/news/hires/2017/scythianhors.jpg

 

[johen]

meanders are common decorative elements in greek and roman art. in ancient greece they appear in many architectural friezes, and in bands on the pottery of ancient greece from the geometric period onwards. the design is common to the present-day in classicizing architecture. the meander is a fundamental design motif in regions far from a hellenic orbit: labyrinthine meanders ("thunder" pattern[3]) appear in bands and as infill on shang bronzes, and many traditional buildings in and around china still bear geometric designs almost identical to meanders

http://www.alaintruong.com/archives/2019/03/04/37149174.html

Maybe the pattern originated in Mal’ta, an Upper Palaeolithic site, even if neolithic balkan and yangshao pottery have that patter.

The most important thing is Malta's sunhead (maybe a concept of circle or mandala) and snake (concept of thunderbolt and fire cult) culture continued generation by generation. ​

https://www.donsmaps.com/malta.html

for example, a petroglyph of shaman sunhead:
www.rupestre.net/tracce/1-11/bre21a.gif
http://www.rupestre.net/tracce/?p=2065

 

[johen]

Altai people cannot be explained without Ring.

Neolithic lake baikal:

okunevo culture:

Human sacrifice dagger in shang china:

Greek eye and snake patterns:

greek art circa 750-650 bce ... max dashu (the "geometric period," that is, the roots of classical greece)

"Women dancing on Boiotian pot, circa 640 BCE. Note the locked hair and the serpents rising up between the dancers."
https://www.suppressedhistories.net/Gallery/greek/geometric.html​

 

[johen]

okunevo:

[the hopi believe that their intimacy with rattlesnakes and other ophidian species engenders rainfall and fecundity upon the high desert.]

^ "lord of rain" and "leader of rain".

I think they are all same concept of malta boy artifact of sun and snake;

"Another example of women in the Libyan style, with locks. Their invocatory gesture indicates a ceremony, again appearing to call down waters from the heavens to fructify the earth"

https://www.suppressedhistories.net/Gallery/greek/geometric.html

okunevo symbols at the bottom of pottery:

http://www.hinduhumanrights.info/pa...alash-tribe-threatened-with-death-by-taliban/

another symbol

https://www.thoughtco.com/time-periods-of-pottery-ancient-greece-118838

 

[johen]

3. The above shaman holds a drum composed of Circle (sky) and Cross. The Cross symbolizes A flying bird (crow) being a messenger from the Circle of sky or heaven. That is a shaman, a messenger from sky or heaven to connect heaven to earth. Ancient zhou king in China was called as a son of sky/heaven天子 , who thought he got a mandate from sky/ heaven天命.

zhou horse burial:

http://www.chinaknowledge.de/History/Zhou/zhou-religion.html

scyhtian horse burial:
https://3c1703fe8d.site.internapcdn.net/newman/gfx/news/hires/2017/scythianhors.jpg

The practice of digging shaft tombs was a widespread phenomenon with prominent examples found in Mycenaean Greece; in Bronze Age China; and in Mesoamerican Western Mexico.[2]

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~prehisto...-gallery/flagframe.php?i=7&f=photo_blog&h=480

shaft tomb in china

http://www.kaogu.cn/en/News/New_discoveries/2015/0616/50594.html

aa

 

[johen]

same pattern and same artifacts in mycenaean and seima turbino:

-> detailed goldwork grave 4 in grave circle a at mycenae:

http://users.stlcc.edu/mfuller/Greece2009/646goldBeautifulWowSm.jpg

-> borodino treature if seima turbino:

same pattern:
http://nav.shm.ru/upload/iblock/4a3/4a32bf8a8406a8d1dbf738206ed76f92.png

same artifacts:
https://www.google.com/search?biw=1...&ved=0ahUKEwj289qI7L3kAhUaIDQIHWnODTUQ4dUDCAY

The relationship between PIE and american Indian language is claimed again:

FrankN said...Since I mentionned possible relations between the PIE and the Proto Nivkh-Algic-Wakashan (PAW) vocabulary in my previous comment, and remember someone having asked about it not too long ago, here follow several examples.
Sources: S. Nikolev 2017 http://www.jolr.ru/files/(232)jlr2017-15-3-4(250-278).pdf
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Proto-Indo-European_Swadesh_list

"belly": PAW *ʔVta:gA, PIE *úderos
"big": PA *meʔł (Miami-Peoria mehš-i), PIE *méǵh₂s
"burn": PNA *tu)ʁwV, PIE dʰegʷʰ-
"come": PW *Gi:, PIE *gʷeh₂-
"die": PNA *mo:ryV, PIE *mer-
"dog": PAW *q’änV, PIE *ḱwṓ [a Wanderwort]
„drink“: PAW *hək’ʷE (also „water“), PIE *h₁egʷʰ-
"egg": PNA *ʔə:wV, PIE *h₂ōwyóm
"fish": PAW *ǯu: , PIE *dʰǵʰu- (->Balto-Slav. *źū́ˀs)
"good": PA *wal-, *wel- [comp. Engl. "well"]
"hair": PAW *həpV(-lV), PIE *pulh₂-
"I": PAW *ńV, PIE *me (a paleo-word)
"kill" PAW *χVlV ≈ *ʔVlχV (compare to English!)
"to lie": PAW *łi:hV, PIE *légʰyeti
"long": PAW *gɨl’V, PIE *dl̥h₁gʰós (metathesis?)
"man, male": PWN *wi:s-, PIE *wiHrós
"meat": PAW *mi:-, PIE *mḗms (a paleo-word, c.f. Malay makan "to eat)
"moon": PAW *l’u:ŋ’ʒV, PIE *lowksneh₂
"night" PAW *ńä:gʷE ~ *ńä:gʷTV, PIE *nókʷts
"nose": PWS *nic-, PIE *Hnéh₂s
"one": PAW *ń’ə, PIE *(H)óynos
"round" PAW *kOlxV ~ *k’Olk’V [No PIE root given, but compare to "wheel" terminology]
"say": PW *wa:-, PIE *wéwket
"see": PWN *du:qʷ-, PIE *derḱ-
"small": PNi *məc-ki-, PIE *mey-
"this": PAW *gV ~ *gʷV, PIE *koh₂ (a paleo-word)
"warm": PWN *kʷu:xʷ-, PIE *gʷʰer-
"water": PAW *hək’ʷE ≈ *ʔəhk’ʷE, PIE *h₂ekʷeh₂
"what, who": PAW *qV, *gʷV; PIE *kʷis (a paleo-root, equally present in PU)
"Woman": PWN *Gən- ; PIE *gʷḗn
"far (away)": PAlg *wa:ɣl-aw, PIE *wi
„heavy“: PWN *Gʷi:- , PIE *gʷréh₂us

 

[Ygorcs]

These are all extremely general similarities that, as I can see, include many other (non-IE) cultures, not just specific IE cultural markers, so I honestly don't think why the IE migration should be explained only by mentioning Seima-Turbino. Besides, being so vague, some of them may be simply repeated cultural patterns and visual archetypes, and some others may be remnants of such a primordial cultural exchange that you can find them even in the Americas, where the aDNA record shows no major genetic changes in most of the continent after the Proto-Amerinds of Late Paleolithic era and only a partial change in some parts of North America more than 5000 years ago.

 

[johen]

If PIE speaker had an combination of EHG and CHG, would it be possible of the other combiantion of WSHG and CHG to be PIE speaker? It seems to me that eneolithic Dali (WSHG and CHG) is related to Torcharian PIE.

https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/39199-Pastoralism-and-farming-in-Bronze-Age-Eurasia

This seima turbino culture seems to be a continuation of that WSHG and CHG.
As I quoted chinese scholar papers several times, PIE clearly landed on china. But who did? The only thing we knew is that cannibalist seima turbino and Karasuk culture were found over there with maximum brutality.
Even if Harvard lab seperates Caucasus cline of east europe and WHSG cline of central asia, we already discussed by a caucasus paper by wang / archaeology paper that the caucasus culture nearly impacted upon steppe culture genetically and archaeologically. So I think the separation is meaningless, and it is why yamna people could migrate into altai.
Yamna culture had sunhead and animal culture like american indian and altai. R1a EHG had mtDNA C with lake baikal pottery, introducing supine burial type of east eurasia. And they were buried with a small amounts of mongoloid skulls.
(I always said that the PIE was created in the trianlge zone of Hotu cave J with baikal pottery, Karelian R1a/J with the pottery and lake baikal R1a, considering yamna admixture)

Every scholar focus upon only arsnic bronze sintashta, but they were surrounded by tin bronze seima turbino. Thus WSHG outlier of sintashata, R1a, r1b and Q1a seems to be seima turbino people. I think this outlier trio were PIE spreaders with zeus/Indra/Tiandi concept to Mycenaean, china bronze and aryan with third eye. The third eye, sky lord and metallurgy of thuderbolt (or snake) concept is closely related with okunevo petroglyph also.
This cannibalist seima turbino has something to do with another cannibalist scythian R1a, R1b, and Q1a with animal art and flexed or ring daggers. Moreover their WSHG territory would be never ruled by any other people EVEN until now. Slavic people genetically has not still run over Volga river at all. When we draw a line between st. Petersburg and Moscow, one side people is Slavic russian and the other Fin russian ethnically.

PIE long braid (= sun's ray) culture
:

china bronze:

aryan sikha:
The sikha or shikha (Sanskrit: शिखा; IAST: śikhā; "crest"; Hindi चोटी (choTi)) means flame, powerful, ray of light, peak of a mountain. It is a name of Hindu / Indian origin, and is commonly used for females. It also means long tuft, or lock of hair, left on top or on the back of the shaven head of a male Orthodox Hindu.

 

[MOESAN]

Johen, I suppose Ygorcs has explained very well mt proper thoughts about vague and general similarities between human cultures.
If I believe Grigoryev (I' m very weak in archeology) Seyma-Turbino would have been a culture (or a metallurgic aspect of culture) passed through South Central Asia, maybe born farther in Southwest, from remote Middle East origin. The later devlopment of this aspect after stage in Altay could have concerned different ethnies and languages, sometimes with intrusion of some male elite (perhaps, some clades of Y-N in future Finno-Ugric lands), I don't know for sure.
ATW I thank you for the documentation you send us here.

 

[johen]

Johen, I suppose Ygorcs has explained very well mt proper thoughts about vague and general similarities between human cultures.
If I believe Grigoryev (I' m very weak in archeology) Seyma-Turbino would have been a culture (or a metallurgic aspect of culture) passed through South Central Asia, maybe born farther in Southwest, from remote Middle East origin. The later devlopment of this aspect after stage in Altay could have concerned different ethnies and languages, sometimes with intrusion of some male elite (perhaps, some clades of Y-N in future Finno-Ugric lands), I don't know for sure.
ATW I thank you for the documentation you send us here.

I think grave circle B in Greece has a key to solve, but when to get their aDNA?
Anyway see the interesting skulls to be related with botai:

The DNA of two buried people from kurgans #67 and #67a of Aigyrzhal-2 site were revealed in arecently-published article on the genetics of Eneolithic and Bronze Age populations on the territoryof Southern and Central Asia. According to the results, these buried people were genetically linkedto the people of the Botai culture in Eneolithic of Kazakhstan (Narasimhan et al., 2019). But thephysical type of the buried people from Aigyrzhal-2 site was not similar to the physical type of theancient Botai people. This is another mystery that will require further research if it is to be solved.

"Picture 6. Aigyrzhal-2. The skull from burial mound number 67a.The Early Bronze Age. Photo by Y. Kitov."

​

​

 

[johen]

^

Same thing here in brand new paper:
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.25.004606v1

The two oldest individuals from the Mongolia ‘West’ cluster have very different ancestry: they are from the Shatar Chuluu kurgan site associated with the Afanasievo culture, with one directly dated to 3316-2918 calBCE (we quote a 95% confidence interval here and in what follows whenever we mention a direct date), and are indistinguishable in ancestry from previously published ancient Afanasievo individuals from the Altai region of present-day Russia (…)

The early Afanasievo individual from Bayankhongor aimag with precise radiocarbon date is of hg. R1b1a1a2a1a-L151, which – if confirmed with BAM inferences – would date the expansion of this lineage back to Late Repin instead of the later West Yamnaya migration, in line with the earlier mean estimates of YTree (compared to YFull). The other individual is of hg. J1, possibly of the same subclade as the Khvalynsk chieftain reported by Anthony (2019).

Another paper shows the R1b guy, who is not related with afanasievo skulls:

So anthropology has a big problem, but genetics is a pure science?

However, american, russian and east asian anthropologist unanimously said that IA chandman skull clusters with xoungnu skull to be proved by genetics. Their skull type is paleo type with cromagnon, jomon and polynesian. anthropologically their skulls could not be created by bronze genes at all.

"A striking finding in light of previous archaeological and genetic data is that the male child from Kurgak govi (individual I13957, skeletal code AT_629) has no evidence of Yamnaya-related ancestry despite his association with Afanasievo material culture (for example, he was buried in a barrow in the form of circular platform edged by vertical stone slabs, in stretched position on the back on the bottom of deep rectangular pit and with a typical Afanasievo egg-shaped vessel; his late Afanasievo chronology is confirmed by a direct radiocarbon date of 2858-2505 BCE). This is the first known case of an individual buried with Afanasievo cultural traditions who is not overwhelmingly Yamnaya-related, and he also shows genetic continuity with an individual buried at the same site Kurgak govi 2 in a square barrow (individual I6361, skeletal code AT_635, direct radiocarbon date 2618-2487 BCE). We label this second individuals as having an Ulgii cultural association, although a different archaeological assessment associates this individual to the Afanasievo or Chemurchek cultures, so it is possible that this provides a second example of Afanasievo material culture being adopted by individuals without any Yamnaya ancestry."

 

[johen]

However, american, russian and east asian anthropologist unanimously said that IA chandman skull clusters with xoungnu skull to be proved by genetics. Their skull type is paleo type with cromagnon, jomon and polynesian. anthropologically their skulls could not be created by bronze genes at all.

I think they look like this:

Kushan ruler:

Xoungnu:

Ephthalites (white Hun)

https://scfh.ru/en/papers/we-drank-s...ame-immortal-/


maybe connected to china brzone and Qin shihuwang also:

 

[johen]

If PIE speaker had an combination of EHG and CHG, would it be possible of the other combiantion of WSHG and CHG to be PIE speaker? It seems to me that eneolithic Dali (WSHG and CHG) is related to Torcharian PIE.

https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/39199-Pastoralism-and-farming-in-Bronze-Age-Eurasia

''The succeeding EBA Chemurchek culture (2750-1900 BCE), a ruminant dairying society
(Wilkin et al., 2019) whose mortuary features include stone slabs and anthropomorphic stelae, has also been purportedly linked to WSH migrations (Kovalev and Erdenebaatar, 2009). Chemurchek graves are found throughout the Altai and in the Dzungar Basin in Xinjiang, China 203 (Jia and Betts, 2010). We analyzed two Chemurchek individuals from the southern Altai site of Yagshiin Huduu and one from Khundii Gobi (KUM001) in the northern Altai. Compared to Afanasievo_Mongolia, the Yagshiin Huduu individuals also show a high degree of Western ancestry but are displaced in PCA (Fig. 2), having also a strong genetic affinity with ANE207 related ancient individuals such as AfontovaGora3 (AG3), West_Siberia_N, and Botai (Fig. 208 3a; Fig. S9, S11). We find that these Chemurchek individuals (Chemurchek_Altai) are genetically similar to Dali_EBA (Fig. 3a)''

2 Z2103 in Chemurchek

 

[johen]

Originally Posted by johenIf PIE speaker had an combination of EHG and CHG, would it be possible of the other combiantion of WSHG and CHG to be PIE speaker? It seems to me that eneolithic Dali (WSHG and CHG) is related to Torcharian PIE.

https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...ze-Age-Eurasia


''The succeeding EBA Chemurchek culture (2750-1900 BCE), a ruminant dairying society
(Wilkin et al., 2019) whose mortuary features include stone slabs and anthropomorphic stelae, has also been purportedly linked to WSH migrations (Kovalev and Erdenebaatar, 2009). Chemurchek graves are found throughout the Altai and in the Dzungar Basin in Xinjiang, China 203 (Jia and Betts, 2010). We analyzed two Chemurchek individuals from the southern Altai site of Yagshiin Huduu and one from Khundii Gobi (KUM001) in the northern Altai. Compared to Afanasievo_Mongolia, the Yagshiin Huduu individuals also show a high degree of Western ancestry but are displaced in PCA (Fig. 2), having also a strong genetic affinity with ANE207 related ancient individuals such as AfontovaGora3 (AG3), West_Siberia_N, and Botai (Fig. 208 3a; Fig. S9, S11). We find that these Chemurchek individuals (Chemurchek_Altai) are genetically similar to Dali_EBA (Fig. 3a)''

2 R1b in Chemurchek

we already know that millet was found in stredny stog culture. I think they would be all WSHG-related people's job including language (nostratic?)

https://www.academia.edu/4970951/Ko...f_Eurasian_Studies._Vol._1_11_._2011._P._1-58

yangshao

Cucuteni. Phase A3.Tell Harsova.(the fertility goddess in Lajja Gauri attitude)

the other pottery similarities between cucuteni and Yangshao:
https://www.scribd.com/document/201...e-Chinese-Bronze-Age-Shang-and-Zhou-dynasties


Poulnabrone dolmen, the Burren, County Clare, Ireland



PIE long braid (= sun's ray) culture

Dolmen at Ganghwa Island, South Korea

PIE long braid (= sun's ray) culture

 

[johen]

Two awesome maps related with PIE

Z93 migration thru ISMC

R1b –L23 ( i.e r1b-z2103 )

- Archaeologically from mesolithic to eneolithic, south ural had contacted to S-E aral sea area, where cattle and horse bones were buried.
- yamna-like khvalynsk Q1a who was not welcomed.
- wagon burial culture of step maykop Q1a in yamna Z2013 pit
- afanasievo Z2103 AND 3 Q1a
- sintashta Z2103 and its outlier WSHG Z2103
- Now Dali-like Z2103 in chemurchek
- Afanasivo R1b PH310 in shatar chuluu kurgan.

see Dali and khvalynsk admizture, are they same people?:

[ R1b-M73 ]

 

[johen]

Altai people cannot be explained without Ring. They seem to be "Ring people." Their elites carried daggers as high-rank soldiers carry pistols. The dagger’s head is a Ring. This tradition started in seima turbino and continued in andronovo, karashuk, china bronze, the celts and even avar. Maybe simple mycenaean sword has also ring. This Ring culture seems to originate in lake baikal, which is directly connected to Hongshan burial. This people focuses even in ring of eye, although they have big almond eyes. I think this kind of ring culture cannot be found in any other place except mesoamerican culture. I think their body genes were changed, but they kept their culture. Ancient people's mind was ruled by their culture, not by their genetics.

Neolithic lake baikal:

okunevo culture:

Human sacrifice dagger in shang china:

https://www.ancient-origins.net/new...ouple-mysterious-jade-rings-and-dagger-006277

caucasoid mask from lop nur (tarim basin), china, 2000–1000 bce: compare okunevo one with large lips

see the ring people's culture in lake baikal and mesoamerica:

"The 7,000 years old Neolithic grave by lake Baikal might belong to one of the world’s oldest settlements."
They were buried in supine-flex position like in yamna/afanasievo and american Indian.

https://siberiantimes.com/other/oth...-egyptian-pyramids-while-working-in-a-garden/


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[TD="class: tr-caption"]The man's skeleton had a ring made of rare white jade over one eye socket
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In Peru

An octopus frontlet made of gold, chrysocolla and shells dating from A.D. 300-600

 

[johen]

anthropomorph in 2000 bc sanauli, india:

[Zeus formular]

Deus or Ancient Greek Zeus > ancient chinese Tees > modern chinese Di( lord, son of sky or heaven): altai petroglyph

chinese bronze script character for Tian ​天, meaning "sky":

Alain Thote, "Chinese coffins from the first millennium B.C. and early images of the afterworld," Res: Anthropology and aesthetics61-62 (Spring-Autumn 2012): 22-40.:

Altai petroglyph:

Zeus or not?

One sample of early La Tène culture A from Putzenfeld am Dürrnberg, Hallein, Austria (ca 450–380 BC)

scythian:
www.encyclopediaofukraine.com/pic%5CS%5CC%5CScythian%20warrior%20skeleton%20in%20Cherkasy%20Oblast%20Regional%20Studies%20Museum.jpg

yamna also:

https://www.academia.edu/37259536/T...RNS_TO_THE_BALTIC_DRAINAGE_BASIN_3200_1750_BC

 

[johen]

How to read this map?

It seems like this:
Seima turbino (tin bronze) : petrovka culture (tin bronze) = okunveo (petroglyph: human-carrying cat) : sintashta (chariot)

Mining tin can be only at altai and east karzak in steppe. Okunevo has sunhead/snake(= thundervolt) and third eye culture.
Okunevo merged with afanasievo, and late Krotovo (seima turbino) merged with andronovo.

Following the Gansu corridor of Hg Q trail, we can meet R1a sintashta culture in the tomb of china bronze, where seima turbino/karashuk entered according to archaeology.
Following the inner asia mountain corridor of Hg R1a trail, we can meet okunvo petroglyph near south asia as K. Zettmar said. That is a relationship of R1a and Q1a

However, geneticists put an emphasis only upon steppe admixture creating Indo-european culture. I think CHG is nothing, but only ANE created that. The steppe people at that time integrated with only the ANE gene.

Why?
B/c Malta artifact (sun and snake) = okunevo petroglyph (sunhead and snake) = zeus/indra sunhead and thundervolt = mesoamerica sunhead and snake or thunderblot at mountain. Yamna has sunhead and animal culture like american indian.

"the eminent scholar, Miles Poindexter, a former ambassador of the United States to Mexico, in his two-volume 1930s treatise “The Ayar-Incas” called the Maya civilization “unquestionably Hindu.”"