Immigration What should Europeans do with illegal immigrants?

[Vallicanus]

And yet they share the little they have.

OMG. How sanctimonious.

 

[Kardu]

And yet they share the little they have.

Not for long. Influx of 100 000 Palestinian Arabs paved the way to the Lebanese civil war. Let's see what's gonna be the outcome of this one with greater number.

 

[bicicleur 2]

I was always voicing that Islamic fundamentalist problem needs to be tackled at the source. This includes Saudi-Arabia rich influential families and their agendas, same goes to Iran arming Shia Muslims. Definitely Saudi Arabia should be sanctioned in many ways by international community. Oil embargo should be in place to hit their deep pockets till they start dealing with it internally, and lose ability to finance their radical clerics.

We addressed it in Free Kurdistan tread.

I never forgave him this stupid decision. This is why US lost trust of ordinary Iraqi people. Iraq also lost a chance for a better fresh start when radical Islam wasn't entrenched in society yet.
I agree, and blindly romantic. Bad combination.

Do you realy think the middle east is better of without Saddam, Khadafi or Assad?
They were cruel and corrupt, but what we see now is worse.
Democracy don't work in these countries.
What would happen do you think if Sisi weren't in Egypt any more?

 

[Vallicanus]

Which countries have more unemployment, the leaders in automation like Japan, US and UK, or the ones without robotics and automation like Greece, Nigeria and Venezuela? Don't take my word for it, the real life has spoken.

I want a level of automation that makes the migration of the unskilled quite unnecessary.

 

[Vallicanus]

Do you realy think the middle east is better of without Saddam, Khadafi or Assad?
They were cruel and corrupt, but what we see now is worse.
Democracy don't work in these countries.
What would happen do you think if Sisi weren't in Egypt any more?

These dictators are a necessary evil for a fractured, fractious and still tribally minded part of the world.

 

[LeBrok]

Do you realy think the middle east is better of without Saddam, Khadafi or Assad?They were cruel and corrupt, but what we see now is worse.

Not at the moment, but give them some time. Do you think europe is better without Hitler, Stalin and Mussolini?

Democracy don't work in these countries.

Did democracy worked in Europe before WW2?

What would happen do you think if Sisi weren't in Egypt any more?

Probably religious tyrant of some kind. Democracy takes time to settle. It took Europe 100 years to finally be democratic and peaceful, in mean time tens of millions lost lives in 2 world wars, and a cold war. Are you expecting miracles in Middle East? Actually, there is one, Tunisia.

 

[LeBrok]

I want a level of automation that makes the migration of the unskilled quite unnecessary.

So you are for skilled migration only?

 

[Tomenable]

To be honest, Europe has also exported a lot of illegal (and often violent) immigrants abroad in the last ~500 years:

http://s23.postimg.org/z56pbzoez/Euro_Diaspora.png

 

[LeBrok]

To be honest, Europe has also exported a lot of illegal (and often violent) immigrants abroad in the last ~500 years:

http://s23.postimg.org/z56pbzoez/Euro_Diaspora.png

What can we say, the world was mixing and is mixing. It is enough to look at European autosomal DNA to see long history of mixing with farmers from Near East and IE from the Steppe, not mentioning smaller admixtures from farther away, or Neanderthal DNA. The long story of migration of humankind.

 

[Vallicanus]

So you are for skilled migration only?

Yes, the Australian model is fine by me, pick and choose who you want, but unfortunately Europe does not have a New Guinea where migrants can be sent for processing.

The Libyan desert is out because Britain and France turned Libya into an anarchic basket case.

 

[Vallicanus]

What can we say, the world was mixing and is mixing. It is enough to look at European autosomal DNA to see long history of mixing with farmers from Near East and IE from the Steppe, not mentioning smaller admixtures from farther away, or Neanderthal DNA. The long story of migration of humankind.

Oh please, this was in prehistory when most of mankind was primitive by modern standards and populations were in hundreds or thousands, not millions.

The UN needs to man up and organise a population control policy in Third World countries, especially in Subsaharan Africa.

 

[Tomenable]

Oh please, this was in prehistory when most of mankind was primitive by modern standards and populations were in hundreds or thousands, not millions.

You must be joking, right?

Just in the last 3000-2000 years a lot of mixing was in Oceania, South-East Asia, Central Asia, Siberia, Latin America, South Africa, East Africa, North America, Middle East. And in Europe ~8000 years ago massive immigration from the Near East, then ~5000 years ago from the steppe. If we go back to Paleolithic times then perhaps the only "pure race" surviving since that time are Andaman Islanders (but they still have Neanderthal admixture).

 

[Tomenable]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=16&v=90U2IqXEvSM

[video=youtube;90U2IqXEvSM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=16&v=90U2IqXEvSM[/video]

 

[Vallicanus]

You must be joking, right?

Just in the last 3000-2000 years a lot of mixing was in Oceania, South-East Asia, Central Asia, Siberia, Latin America, South Africa, East Africa, North America, Middle East. And in Europe ~8000 years ago massive immigration from the Near East, then ~5000 years ago from the steppe. If we go back to Paleolithic times then perhaps the only "pure race" surviving since that time are Andaman Islanders (but they still have Neanderthal admixture).

I'm talking about Europe, most of which has altered little in the genetic sense since the Bronze Age. Is 3000 years not enough for you.

Most of the mixing in both North and South America was not 2000-3000 years ago but since 1492.

 

[Tomenable]

I'm talking about Europe, most of which has altered little in the genetic sense since the Bronze Age

Accepting Syrian Christian refugees will not alter it either. They are practically identical with European groups such as Sardinians or Greeks.

So it's like letting in Southern Europeans, who are already here.

Moreover, Christians and other religious minorities tend to be most educated parts of Middle Eastern populations, since they aren't inbred.

 

[Vallicanus]

Accepting Syrian Christian refugees will not alter it either. They are practically identical with European groups such as Sardinians or Greeks.

So it's like letting in Southern Europeans, who are already here.

Moreover, Christians and other religious minorities tend to be most educated parts of Middle Eastern populations, since they aren't inbred.

I agree with you here.

 

[Kardu]

To be honest, Europe has also exported a lot of illegal (and often violent) immigrants abroad in the last ~500 years:

That was conquest and colonization - natural events of the historical process, which was met by armed resistance by local populations.
Do you imply that this influx of migrants is a concquest and colonization and therefore must be met with armed rssistance?!

 

[bicicleur 2]

Not at the moment, but give them some time. Do you think europe is better without Hitler, Stalin and Mussolini?
Did democracy worked in Europe before WW2?
Probably religious tyrant of some kind. Democracy takes time to settle. It took Europe 100 years to finally be democratic and peaceful, in mean time tens of millions lost lives in 2 world wars, and a cold war. Are you expecting miracles in Middle East? Actually, there is one, Tunisia.

Modern Europe was not formed the last 100 years, it was formed the last 600 years.
Before democracy is possible in these countries these people should first accept some of the western values that develloped during these 600 years.
In the mean time avoid that these local dictators become to ambitious but do not replace them.
That is what Bush Sr did with Desert Storm in Irak.
I hope Tunisia will survive, but the odds are they gonna get into the grip of Islamic fundamentalists who are trying to destabilise the country with terror.

 

[bicicleur 2]

Accepting Syrian Christian refugees will not alter it either. They are practically identical with European groups such as Sardinians or Greeks.

So it's like letting in Southern Europeans, who are already here.

Moreover, Christians and other religious minorities tend to be most educated parts of Middle Eastern populations, since they aren't inbred.

something I just read, sorry, it's in Dutch

http://www.knack.be/nieuws/wereld/h...Echobox&utm_medium=social&utm_source=Facebook

in Turkey you can buy fake Syrian passports to make yourself more eligible for asylum in Europe

 

[LeBrok]

Oh please, this was in prehistory when most of mankind was primitive by modern standards and populations were in hundreds or thousands, not millions.

The UN needs to man up and organise a population control policy in Third World countries, especially in Subsaharan Africa.

The methods of EU are very primitive to process such big number of refugees. Solution is needed urgently.