chiquiliquis said:
Please check all that applied in your L2 experiences:
- Broken home
- Neighbourhood violence
- Racism and discrimination in the workplace
- Racism and discrimination at school
- No appropriate tools for measuring L1 at school
- No access to L2 at home
- Illiteracy in L1
- Dyslexia
- No TV/Telephone/Internet
Do you mean all those which I experienced while learning a foreign language. Won't say
broken home, but I almost always learnt when I lived abroad by myself, far from my family.
Racism and discrimination in the workplace ? Well, I learned all those language (but Japanese) before getting my first job. As for Japanese, we could argue that there is some form of
Racism and discrimination toward foreigners in Japan.
No access to L2 at home ? Of course, my parents don't speak any foreign language fluently.
You aren't the only one here who speaks more than one language. Our successes don't mean that everyone should have as easy a time learning languages as we did. Does your experience attempt to speak for the world? This is called, according to the Chiquiliquis Dictionary 1) being ridiculously narrow-minded 2) a very slippery argument. No TV/Telephone/Internet ? I didn't watch TV or touch a computer during about 5 years because of eyes problems. During that time, I learned 5 foreign languages. By that time, I had never used the Internet and almost never used the phone (except public phones ?).
Anyway, I don't think these factors substantially refrain people from learning a language (at the contrary, it stimulates them). Dyslexia is the only one, but you won't make me believe that all the "Hispanics" in the US who don't speak English are dyslexic.
But, DO NOT FORGET: We are all different people.
But not different species. All non-retarded humans have similar capabilities, given the enough motivation. I don't believe in "natural gifts". I used to be very bad at foreign languages, but I could reverse this through efforts, motivation and improved changing my learning methods.
The test is given to X in Spanish, as his parents both speak Spanish at a functionally fluent level, the advocate had assumed (beware that word!) that X also spoke Spanish.
If you are referring to an IQ test, the only reliable ones are "non-verbal" and thus one's first language does not matter at all. I can't believe that the US educational system would consider someone as "retarded" without making such a test, and without making sure what is someone's mother tongue.
By the end of his fourth grade, however, it is revealed that X is dyslexic.
Alright, but you are talking about exceptions, not the average people.
By middle school, X has reached a point where he can speak "playground" English with a substantial amount of ease ("gimme the ball"; "what ball?"; "the red ball, over there"). He still struggles with dyslexia, and cannot yet fully participate in mainstream classes
If other children all speak English (or Spanish) and the teachers do too, there is no reason any
normal child wouldn't pick up the language naturally. What about expats' children who join classes in a foreign country in a language they do not understand at all, but can speak fluently after a year or two, even when their parents can't. I know many such cases. I also know cases of refugees (to Europe) whose children picked up the language at school without any difficulty, even slang and dialects. It took a bit longer for the parents (maybe 3 to 5 years) to become fluent, but eventually they managed, even without any money.
If you're not clear on the definition of "illiterate" please go visit your local immigrant-refugee counselling service and find out if they offer language assistance to their clients.
Well, as a matter of fact they do. And all for free, especially for refugees and immigrants. But that is in Europe, not in the US.
If you would like to talk about what "Hispanic" means, let's start another thread... but I fully accept and understand you position on this... though I fail to see it's relevance to this thread.
What you missed is my insistence that
Spanish speakers can learn English quite easily. I never mentioned Native Americans speaking rare languages.