Macedonians

[Yetos]

We are not talking about E, but E-V13. We already have plenty of Indo-European samples that are E-V13. Additionally, E-V13's parent clade E-L618 was also already found in the West Balkans at the close of the Neolithic. Also, E* has a distance of 50 thousand + or so years from E-V13. So, I am not sure what you're trying to imply by your comment.

The only people who claim E-V13 is North African are either people who know very little about Y-DNA evolution or have an agenda.

Using your logic, R1a and R1b are just Siberians because they come from R1 Mal'ta boy. It is important to understand the difference between subclades and parent clades. E-V13's connection to North Africa is ancient, and before any culture of relevance.

correct, minus is not IE marker, but rather Balkan primary, Anatolian/ Near East secondary.
It is Neolithic, Not IE.

 

[Yetos]

""The only people who claim E-V13 is North African are either people who know very little about Y-DNA evolution or have an agenda.""

Of course he has an agenda.

""halplogroup I is derived from middle eastern haplogroup J. so not european."" Haplogroup IJ would have arrived from the Middle East to Europe some 35,000 years ago, then developed into haplogroup I soon afterwards. In Europe for 35,000 years, yep that makes it European. Just Like the Chinese Haplogroup O at one time came from the Middle East if you go back far enough because it came from F to K, the ancestor of most of the Eurasian haplogroups (L, N, O, P, Q, R and T), some time between 45,000 and 35,000 years ago. So what.

IJ and ED show strange spread,

both E and D comes from ED but in Far East we see D, and E at horn of Africa,
same I and J comes from IJ but at Asia mainly we see J and at Europe mainly I.

how that is done?

 

[Dorquest]

IJ and ED show strange spread,

both E and D comes from ED but in Far East we see D, and E at horn of Africa,
same I and J comes from IJ but at Asia mainly we see J and at Europe mainly I.

how that is done?

I would guess...Time, movement of people – death of lineages

 

[Yetos]

I would guess...Time, movement of people – death of lineages

I do not know

 

[Dibran]

correct, minus is not IE marker, but rather Balkan primary, Anatolian/ Near East secondary.
It is Neolithic, Not IE.

Wrong. E-V13 exploded with Indo-European migrations. People have this weird idea that if it is not R1a or R1b that it cannot be Indo-European. That is incorrect. It for sure is not Proto-Indo-European. However, E-V13 expanded with Indo-Europeans.

 

[Jovialis]

israel is derived from ancient kemetic gods ISIS RA EL
jesus is another name for HORUS and SHAITAN aka SATAN is derived from SET

basically astrotheological sun and moon worship. sunRAise (light) and sunSET (darkness)
horus and set battle every day, day vs night, dark vs light, summer vs winter

bible is derived from sun worship, helios byblos, egyptian sun papers and book of dead
the middle east was once part of africa but it split away. the kemetic/egyptian mythologies and middle eastern overlap since the ancient hebrews came from egypt to middle east not vice versa. jesus and mary story is based on isis and horus

christianity is from egypt, so is judaism and islam. jew is derived from egyptian tehuti = yehudi and kaballah is derived from egyptian KA(life force) and BA (soul).

we say AMEN from egyptian AMUN RA

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I am not going to allow you to fill this forum up with trash.

 

[Jovialis]

Let's get back on topic, everyone. I will re-open the thread.

 

[Yetos]

Wrong. E-V13 exploded with Indo-European migrations. People have this weird idea that if it is not R1a or R1b that it cannot be Indo-European. That is incorrect. It for sure is not Proto-Indo-European. However, E-V13 expanded with Indo-Europeans.

It is Neolithic, Not Eurasian steppe. and most possible Balkan mark, It is impossible to be IE.
It did not enter Balkans at Bronzeage ...

 

[Dibran]

It is Neolithic, Not Eurasian steppe. and most possible Balkan mark, It is impossible to be IE.
It did not enter Balkans at Bronzeage ...

E-V13 exploded and expanded in the Bronze Age. This is common knowledge at this point. It formed in the Neolthic. However, the most recent ancestor who is the forefather of all living E-V13 men lived in the Bronze Age(4800ybp) and can be found in numerous Indo-European graves and is linked with the expansion of Indo-Europeans alongside R1a and R1b. This is why I said only R1a/R1b are Proto-Indo-European and the rest can be classified as Indo-European through the course of cross assimilation. Because in the case of Europeans, most of them certainly are. There are even branches of G that spread with Celts. There is such a thing as branches and sub-branches. Context is important.

E-V13 was linked to the elite dominance of Bronze Age society. The geographic distribution of E-V13 quickly spread to all parts of Europe, but was especially common in Central Europe. The only Bronze Age migration that could account for such a fast and far-reaching dispersal is that of the Proto-Indo-Europeans. At present the most consistent explanation is that E-V13 developed from E-M78 in Central or Eastern Europe during the Neolithic period, and was assimilated by the R1a and R1b Proto-Indo-Europeans.

 

[kingdavid]

Let's get back on topic, everyone. I will re-open the thread.

thanks
kudos for you an angella for cleaning the mess it is not an easy job
he was an austrian troll

 

[Yetos]

E-V13 exploded and expanded in the Bronze Age. This is common knowledge at this point. It formed in the Neolthic. However, the most recent ancestor who is the forefather of all living E-V13 men lived in the Bronze Age(4800ybp) and can be found in numerous Indo-European graves and is linked with the expansion of Indo-Europeans alongside R1a and R1b. This is why I said only R1a/R1b are Proto-Indo-European and the rest can be classified as Indo-European through the course of cross assimilation. Because in the case of Europeans, most of them certainly are. There are even branches of G that spread with Celts. There is such a thing as branches and sub-branches. Context is important.

E-V13 was linked to the elite dominance of Bronze Age society. The geographic distribution of E-V13 quickly spread to all parts of Europe, but was especially common in Central Europe. The only Bronze Age migration that could account for such a fast and far-reaching dispersal is that of the Proto-Indo-Europeans. At present the most consistent explanation is that E-V13 developed from E-M78 in Central or Eastern Europe during the Neolithic period, and was assimilated by the R1a and R1b Proto-Indo-Europeans.

Your post is clear the answer.

you have answer your shelf.
no need for me,

you already wrote Neolithic,

Bronze age at Balkans is the most far 3500 BC.

How much old is the sample found at Adriatic/Dinaric area?
is there any hg E Eurasian steppe?

 

[Dibran]

Your post is clear the answer.

you have answer your shelf.
no need for me,

you already wrote Neolithic,

Bronze age at Balkans is the most far 3500 BC.

How much old is the sample found at Adriatic/Dinaric area?
is there any hg E Eurasian steppe?

You're missing the entire point. But, then again; you always miss the point.

 

[DuPidh]

We really don't care what other nations opinions are. Opinion are like...well you know. Everyone has one.

Yetos just likes to assume everyone want's to be Greek. First time I'm hearing this. That would be the last identity I would petition for.

OMG! Greeks have that attitude even in in English speaking world. They think being Greek carries extra social points. Only to find that for the Northern people Greeks are Wogs. ( I am not sure if i wrote it correct).I guess they call Albanians wogs as well, but Albanians keep a low profile in general so are mostly invisible ethnic groups, but Greeks are really offended by the epithet.

 

[Yetos]

You're missing the entire point. But, then again; you always miss the point.

I don't think I am missing something,
Simply place place things to their positions,
Removing 'extras' it is nother thing Neolithic, another European and another IE.

 

[Yetos]

OMG! Greeks have that attitude even in in English speaking world. They think being Greek carries extra social points. Only to find that for the Northern people Greeks are Wogs. ( I am not sure if i wrote it correct).I guess they call Albanians wogs as well, but Albanians keep a low profile in general so are mostly invisible ethnic groups, but Greeks are really offended by the epithet.

hahaha,

Do tell this to me, Tell it to some other who think they are Myceneans, Homeric people etc etc.

 

[TetaEglantina]

OMG! Greeks have that attitude even in in English speaking world. They think being Greek carries extra social points. Only to find that for the Northern people Greeks are Wogs. ( I am not sure if i wrote it correct).I guess they call Albanians wogs as well, but Albanians keep a low profile in general so are mostly invisible ethnic groups, but Greeks are really offended by the epithet.

Well, most albanians aren't "wogs" and I'm sure there are plenty greeks too. Do they also call Italians, Spanish, Portuguese and Serbs wogs for being darker tone?

A lot of northern people look like wogs when they go on holiday btw. If you look at haplogroups, it tends to be only regions with significant amount of i1 that have a lot of blondes and there aren't many of these regions left

 

[Jovialis]

The saying goes, "The wogs begin at Calais". Also stop using that word, guys, because it is inappropriate for the forum.


Funny anecdote, I was in an Irish bar, one New Year's eve with a friend, and we became acquainted with a British guy there. He had an accent, so he was from England. He asked about us, where we came from. I told him I was Italian, but later he referred to me as Albanian. I corrected him, and he sharply, yet jokingly replied, "Whatever, you all look the same"


Also, I know quite a few Albanians. My friend married an Albanian, and I went to their wedding. Some of them seemed pretty dark to me, they could easily pass for Sicilian. But like in all southern European groups, there is a lot of phenotypic-diversity. My friend's wife has blonde hair and blue eyes.

 

[Jovialis]

Well, most albanians aren't "wogs" and I'm sure there are plenty greeks too. Do they also call Italians, Spanish, Portuguese and Serbs wogs for being darker tone?
A lot of northern people look like wogs when they go on holiday btw. If you look at haplogroups, it tends to be only regions with significant amount of i1 that have a lot of blondes and there aren't many of these regions left

Haplogroups do not dictate phenotype. Autosomal DNA is responsible for this.

Albanian autosomal DNA is predominately Anatolian_N + CHG/IN. Steppe and WHG are minority components. The same can be said for many Italians.

 

[DuPidh]

This Wog thing I mentioned this is especially pronounced in Australia. Its no longer active in USA. But I brought the topic because I saw Australian Greeks protest about it. Who cares if someone calls you Wog, let alone protest. What you have to do is make the other work for you, through going to school, excelling in school, building a prosperous life for yourself, being socially fair and helpful

 

[torzio]

This Wog thing I mentioned this is especially pronounced in Australia. Its no longer active in USA. But I brought the topic because I saw Australian Greeks protest about it. Who cares if someone calls you Wog, let alone protest. What you have to do is make the other work for you, through going to school, excelling in school, building a prosperous life for yourself, being socially fair and helpful

The Wog thing from Australia was originally meant to be on for the early chinese in Australia...it means Western Oriental Gentleman

the other is Dago ............which was meant for Italians and spanish as it came from the spanish christian name Diego ............Diego is spanish for James ............James is associated with Jimmy .............a jimmy is slang in australia for a foreigner