Question Few questions about my DNA

[Fedro]

Hi everyone, this will be a long thread! But if you know something about population genetics and you've nothing better, you're welcome!
I've always been interested in genetics (I've recently started a medicine class at the university), and i tested me and my parents because I was curious. I've never expected nothing special because my mother is northem italian (Romagna) and my father is half northem italian and half Swiss (ticino/basel).
I've been tested twice, ony with Myheritage and one with 23andme. My parents just myheritage.
Using some admixture calculators and other platforms, after uploading the raw data, I've noticed few littre interesting facts. Today I'll write just one and if i see answers I'll write more.
Looking to Gedmatch, don't you think my mother is quite south shifted for a northem italian? Illustrativedna and ancestralgenome give 12% of zagros, when my father has only 2-3%. Is't it quite high. Also using G25 coords and gedmatch kits it looks like she had something like a southern italian Grand parent. There are also in my kit some north african traces sometimes, but they seems coming more (if real) from my paternal side? (i have 2.06% NA but she has nothing in k36, my mother seems to have less NA in general but a compact segment of northeast african in K15 or Subsaharan in k13 on chr 6 that looks quite strange) . Even 23and me gave me 11% southern italian and on mytrueancestry there are some greek, minoan and mycenean matches. My maternal family side is 300% from that part of italy!
My question: Is Romagna just southern shifted or I shouldn't exclude a cheating/Adopting event in my family? I'll put here our Gedmatch kits and G25 scaled coords, if you want to check. I'll put also k36 and k13 of my mother. Thanks for possible anwers.

ME myheritage: BK6216646

ME 23andme: NK7685069

me,0.113823,0.150298,0.026398,-0.013566,0.02739,-0.001116,-0.002115,-0.006231,0.007363,0.013485,-0.00747,0.002098,-0.002676,-0.006881,-0.006379,-0.012861,-0.020992,0.011655,0.009804,-0.018384,-0.007861,0.005688,-0.00037,0.00482,0.005868

MOTHER: EV7534623

mother,0.111547,0.14319,0.010936,-0.014858,0.021542,-0.010598,-0.002585,0.000692,0.008795,0.020046,-0.002923,0.004046,-0.006095,-0.007707,-0.006243,0.003447,0.002347,0.007728,0.006285,-0.011631,-0.006364,-0.001484,-0.007518,0.004699,-0.002275

FATHER: YQ8039493

Father,0.1161,0.148267,0.035826,-0.00969,0.031698,0.007809,-0.007285,0.000462,0.009613,0.018588,-0.001624,-3e-04,-0.007879,0.003716,-0.003529,-0.008088,-0.011735,0.007601,0.002514,-0.009379,0.000624,0.004699,0.001849,0.005422,0.001796

K13

North_Atlantic	29.02%
Baltic	10.17%
West_Med	20.12%
West_Asian	9.76%
East_Med	23.92%
Red_Sea	4.15%
South_Asian	0.76%
East_Asian	-
Siberian	-
Amerindian	0.39%
Oceanian	0.79%
Northeast_African	0.83%
Sub-Saharan	0.11%

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Population​

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Percentage​

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k36

Amerindian	-
Arabian	1.99%
Armenian	3.92%
Basque	1.08%
Central_African	-
Central_Euro	7.35%
East_African	-
East_Asian	-
East_Balkan	3.29%
East_Central_Asian	-
East_Central_Euro	1.51%
East_Med	11.07%
Eastern_Euro	-
Fennoscandian	0.75%
French	-
Iberian	19.94%
Indo-Chinese	-
Italian	22.46%
Malayan	-
Near_Eastern	7.95%
North_African	-
North_Atlantic	1.00%
North_Caucasian	1.10%
North_Sea	9.09%
Northeast_African	0.06%
Oceanian	0.07%
Omotic	-
Pygmy	-
Siberian	-
South_Asian	-
South_Central_Asian	1.92%
South_Chinese	-
Volga-Ural	-
West_African	-
West_Caucasian	0.65%
West_Med	4.80%

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Population​

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Percentage​

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[Power]

your moms K13 results seem normal for romagna . she scores like a tuscan with a little more north atlantic .

i ran your moms coordinates through one of my G25 models and she scores 13.6 % Zagros but only 1% CHG ...which i find very interesting

Target: mother
Distance: 3.7612% / 0.03761202
60.2 Northwest_Anatolia_Neolithic_Ilipinar_Bursa
24.0 East_European_Hunter_Gatherer
13.6 Zagros_Neolithic
1.2 WHG
1.0 CHG_Georgia_Kotias.SG

 

[Stefano]

Don't worry, your mother is perfectly within the genetic variation of Romagna, which is really southern shifted, more southern than part of Tuscany, due to massive imperial roman and byzantine influx.
Are the G25 coordinates simulated or real?

Distance to: mother
0.02183719 Italian_Tuscany_South
0.02190760 San_Marino
0.02202503 Cisalpine_Romagna
0.02236188 Italian_PesaroUrbino
0.02241250 Italian_Tuscany_North
0.02262953 Italian_Pisa-Livorno
0.02302352 Greek_Aetolia-Acarnania
0.02438989 Cisalpine_Emilia_East
0.02452138 Italian_Umbria_North
0.02470521 Cisalpine_Nure-Taro
0.02487842 Italian_Lazio_North
0.02547723 Italian_Gargano
0.02560613 Cisalpine_Piacentino
0.02571883 Italian_Umbria_South
0.02601087 Cisalpine_Liguria_East
0.02610607 Greek_Attica
0.02652097 Cisalpine_Oltregiogo
0.02670232 Italian_Lazio
0.02695261 Cisalpine_Vogherese
0.02714056 Italian_AscoliPiceno
0.02724830 Garfagnana
0.02727372 Italian_Abruzzo
0.02761765 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.02765778 Greek_Boeotia
0.02767964 Greek_Epirus

Distance to: Father
0.02569086 Cisalpine_Torino
0.02591351 Cisalpine_Bellunese
0.02713017 Cisalpine_Carnian
0.02728723 Cisalpine_Veronese
0.02798326 Cisalpine_Pordenone
0.02800685 Cisalpine_Brianza
0.02842967 Cisalpine_Langhe
0.02857430 Cisalpine_Friuli
0.02860359 Cisalpine_Ladinia
0.02900241 Cisalpine_Trevigiano
0.02914307 Cisalpine_Cuneo
0.02917600 Cisalpine_Novara_Vercelli
0.02919358 Cisalpine_Lessinia
0.02954457 Cisalpine_Comasco
0.02975934 Cisalpine_Lower_Camunia
0.02985761 Cisalpine_Trentino
0.03005628 Cisalpine_Biella
0.03008251 Cisalpine_Vicentino
0.03013126 Cisalpine_Milanese
0.03043427 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.03052087 Cisalpine_Bolzano
0.03060540 Cisalpine_Ticino
0.03065787 Cisalpine_ValNon
0.03066694 Cisalpine_Verbano_Cusio _Ossola
0.03078722 Cisalpine_Monferrato

Distance to: you
0.03820305 Cisalpine_Veronese
0.03919985 Cisalpine_Piacentino
0.03986585 Cisalpine_Brianza
0.03996525 Cisalpine_Oltregiogo
0.04013426 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.04021892 Cisalpine_Liguria_East
0.04031572 Cisalpine_Torino
0.04055095 Cisalpine_Vogherese
0.04055137 Cisalpine_Frignano
0.04059891 Cisalpine_Langhe
0.04062365 Cisalpine_Monferrato
0.04068008 Cisalpine_Nure-Taro
0.04079271 San_Marino
0.04087853 Cisalpine_Novara_Vercelli
0.04117704 Cisalpine_Reggio-Parma
0.04126295 Cisalpine_Romagna
0.04130182 Cisalpine_Carnian
0.04136876 Cisalpine_Emilia_East
0.04140710 Cisalpine_Lower_Camunia
0.04142073 Garfagnana
0.04145746 Cisalpine_Liguria_West
0.04172925 Cisalpine_Lunigiana
0.04178473 Cisalpine_Milanese

 

[Vallicanus]

Hi everyone, this will be a long thread! But if you know something about population genetics and you've nothing better, you're welcome!
I've always been interested in genetics (I've recently started a medicine class at the university), and i tested me and my parents because I was curious. I've never expected nothing special because my mother is northem italian (Romagna) and my father is half northem italian and half Swiss (ticino/basel).
I've been tested twice, ony with Myheritage and one with 23andme. My parents just myheritage.
Using some admixture calculators and other platforms, after uploading the raw data, I've noticed few littre interesting facts. Today I'll write just one and if i see answers I'll write more.
Looking to Gedmatch, don't you think my mother is quite south shifted for a northem italian? Illustrativedna and ancestralgenome give 12% of zagros, when my father has only 2-3%. Is't it quite high. Also using G25 coords and gedmatch kits it looks like she had something like a southern italian Grand parent. There are also in my kit some north african traces sometimes, but they seems coming more (if real) from my paternal side? (i have 2.06% NA but she has nothing in k36, my mother seems to have less NA in general but a compact segment of northeast african in K15 or Subsaharan in k13 on chr 6 that looks quite strange) . Even 23and me gave me 11% southern italian and on mytrueancestry there are some greek, minoan and mycenean matches. My maternal family side is 300% from that part of italy!
My question: Is Romagna just southern shifted or I shouldn't exclude a cheating/Adopting event in my family? I'll put here our Gedmatch kits and G25 scaled coords, if you want to check. I'll put also k36 and k13 of my mother. Thanks for possible anwers.

ME myheritage: BK6216646

ME 23andme: NK7685069

me,0.113823,0.150298,0.026398,-0.013566,0.02739,-0.001116,-0.002115,-0.006231,0.007363,0.013485,-0.00747,0.002098,-0.002676,-0.006881,-0.006379,-0.012861,-0.020992,0.011655,0.009804,-0.018384,-0.007861,0.005688,-0.00037,0.00482,0.005868

MOTHER: EV7534623

mother,0.111547,0.14319,0.010936,-0.014858,0.021542,-0.010598,-0.002585,0.000692,0.008795,0.020046,-0.002923,0.004046,-0.006095,-0.007707,-0.006243,0.003447,0.002347,0.007728,0.006285,-0.011631,-0.006364,-0.001484,-0.007518,0.004699,-0.002275

FATHER: YQ8039493

Father,0.1161,0.148267,0.035826,-0.00969,0.031698,0.007809,-0.007285,0.000462,0.009613,0.018588,-0.001624,-3e-04,-0.007879,0.003716,-0.003529,-0.008088,-0.011735,0.007601,0.002514,-0.009379,0.000624,0.004699,0.001849,0.005422,0.001796

K13

North_Atlantic	29.02%
Baltic	10.17%
West_Med	20.12%
West_Asian	9.76%
East_Med	23.92%
Red_Sea	4.15%
South_Asian	0.76%
East_Asian	-
Siberian	-
Amerindian	0.39%
Oceanian	0.79%
Northeast_African	0.83%
Sub-Saharan	0.11%

[th]
Population

[/th][th]
Percentage

[/th]​

k36

Amerindian	-
Arabian	1.99%
Armenian	3.92%
Basque	1.08%
Central_African	-
Central_Euro	7.35%
East_African	-
East_Asian	-
East_Balkan	3.29%
East_Central_Asian	-
East_Central_Euro	1.51%
East_Med	11.07%
Eastern_Euro	-
Fennoscandian	0.75%
French	-
Iberian	19.94%
Indo-Chinese	-
Italian	22.46%
Malayan	-
Near_Eastern	7.95%
North_African	-
North_Atlantic	1.00%
North_Caucasian	1.10%
North_Sea	9.09%
Northeast_African	0.06%
Oceanian	0.07%
Omotic	-
Pygmy	-
Siberian	-
South_Asian	-
South_Central_Asian	1.92%
South_Chinese	-
Volga-Ural	-
West_African	-
West_Caucasian	0.65%
West_Med	4.80%

[th]
Population

[/th][th]
Percentage

[/th]​

I am @0.02671750 from your father, @0.03419026 from your mother and @0.03735417 from yourself.

Where would I be located in the chart above?

 

[HereToLearn]

It would be cool to have the Italian members of this forum with G25 coordinates on a PCA plot also including ancient samples.

 

[Fedro]

Don't worry, your mother is perfectly within the genetic variation of Romagna, which is really southern shifted, more southern than part of Tuscany, due to massive imperial roman and byzantine influx.
Are the G25 coordinates simulated or real?

Distance to: mother
0.02183719 Italian_Tuscany_South
0.02190760 San_Marino
0.02202503 Cisalpine_Romagna
0.02236188 Italian_PesaroUrbino
0.02241250 Italian_Tuscany_North
0.02262953 Italian_Pisa-Livorno
0.02302352 Greek_Aetolia-Acarnania
0.02438989 Cisalpine_Emilia_East
0.02452138 Italian_Umbria_North
0.02470521 Cisalpine_Nure-Taro
0.02487842 Italian_Lazio_North
0.02547723 Italian_Gargano
0.02560613 Cisalpine_Piacentino
0.02571883 Italian_Umbria_South
0.02601087 Cisalpine_Liguria_East
0.02610607 Greek_Attica
0.02652097 Cisalpine_Oltregiogo
0.02670232 Italian_Lazio
0.02695261 Cisalpine_Vogherese
0.02714056 Italian_AscoliPiceno
0.02724830 Garfagnana
0.02727372 Italian_Abruzzo
0.02761765 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.02765778 Greek_Boeotia
0.02767964 Greek_Epirus

Distance to: Father
0.02569086 Cisalpine_Torino
0.02591351 Cisalpine_Bellunese
0.02713017 Cisalpine_Carnian
0.02728723 Cisalpine_Veronese
0.02798326 Cisalpine_Pordenone
0.02800685 Cisalpine_Brianza
0.02842967 Cisalpine_Langhe
0.02857430 Cisalpine_Friuli
0.02860359 Cisalpine_Ladinia
0.02900241 Cisalpine_Trevigiano
0.02914307 Cisalpine_Cuneo
0.02917600 Cisalpine_Novara_Vercelli
0.02919358 Cisalpine_Lessinia
0.02954457 Cisalpine_Comasco
0.02975934 Cisalpine_Lower_Camunia
0.02985761 Cisalpine_Trentino
0.03005628 Cisalpine_Biella
0.03008251 Cisalpine_Vicentino
0.03013126 Cisalpine_Milanese
0.03043427 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.03052087 Cisalpine_Bolzano
0.03060540 Cisalpine_Ticino
0.03065787 Cisalpine_ValNon
0.03066694 Cisalpine_Verbano_Cusio _Ossola
0.03078722 Cisalpine_Monferrato

Distance to: you
0.03820305 Cisalpine_Veronese
0.03919985 Cisalpine_Piacentino
0.03986585 Cisalpine_Brianza
0.03996525 Cisalpine_Oltregiogo
0.04013426 Cisalpine_LagunaVeneta
0.04021892 Cisalpine_Liguria_East
0.04031572 Cisalpine_Torino
0.04055095 Cisalpine_Vogherese
0.04055137 Cisalpine_Frignano
0.04059891 Cisalpine_Langhe
0.04062365 Cisalpine_Monferrato
0.04068008 Cisalpine_Nure-Taro
0.04079271 San_Marino
0.04087853 Cisalpine_Novara_Vercelli
0.04117704 Cisalpine_Reggio-Parma
0.04126295 Cisalpine_Romagna
0.04130182 Cisalpine_Carnian
0.04136876 Cisalpine_Emilia_East
0.04140710 Cisalpine_Lower_Camunia
0.04142073 Garfagnana
0.04145746 Cisalpine_Liguria_West
0.04172925 Cisalpine_Lunigiana
0.04178473 Cisalpine_Milanese

Thank you! I didn't think Romagna was so southern shifted, I think that is wrong to consider italy north and south when in fact is a north-south gradient! Yeah the byzantines apart from the romans were also there. The coords are real.

 

[Fedro]

Thank for the answers! you mentioned the romans who really shaped the mediterranean genetic profile, maybe they're the answer of my next question. I found this little segment, nearly identical in my mother chr painting who is always read as East african ( EG k36), Northeast african (EG k13 and 15) and even Subsaharan (just in my mother in k13). Is it just noise? Maybe some Levantine that is misread? I also noticed that in some calculator is read Like 50%East african and 50% northwestafrican (dodevad v3) and has an "interruption" and a second part. I show you some photos. Another strage thing is that usually my father (who is more northem shifted being half swiss) gets more north african than my mother, (from 1 to 3%) and even illustrativeDNA gives him 3.2 Berber in iron age and 2.2 medioeval north african, when my mother has just 1.2 medioeval norh african. I think that traces of NA or even SSA are possible but still rare in northem italy, Could it have something to do with the romans? Just noise? What do you think?

In the photos: k36(green= east african) k15 (pink=NE africa, grey=ssa), dodecad v3 (blue= East Africa, purple=northeast africa), dodecan k12b (brown=NW africa, light blue=East africa).

 

[davef]

Wow that’s surprising! They really go that south eh? I figured it would be more north

 

[HereToLearn]

Wow that’s surprising! They really go that south eh? I figured it would be more north

Honestly I don't see that as surprising. First because we're discussing minimal differences at the end of the day but also geographically, the northern part of Tuscany is aligned with Romagna - it is not like we're talking of Romagna and say Campania after all.

 

[Fedro]

Thank for the answers! you mentioned the romans who really shaped the mediterranean genetic profile, maybe they're the answer of my next question. I found this little segment, nearly identical in my mother chr painting who is always read as East african ( EG k36), Northeast african (EG k13 and 15) and even Subsaharan (just in my mother in k13). Is it just noise? Maybe some Levantine that is misread? I also noticed that in some calculator is read Like 50%East african and 50% northwestafrican (dodevad v3) and has an "interruption" and a second part. I show you some photos. Another strage thing is that usually my father (who is more northem shifted being half swiss) gets more north african than my mother, (from 1 to 3%) and even illustrativeDNA gives him 3.2 Berber in iron age and 2.2 medioeval north african, when my mother has just 1.2 medioeval norh african. I think that traces of NA or even SSA are possible but still rare in northem italy, Could it have something to do with the romans? Just noise? What do you think?

In the photos: k36(green= east african) k15 (pink=NE africa, grey=ssa), dodecad v3 (blue= East Africa, purple=northeast africa), dodecan k12b (brown=NW africa, light blue=East africa).

I've also tried this calculator on Admixture studio me and gives a bit of iberomaurusian, what do you think, is it just this calcolator oversensitive? Are Tolan's calculators good? Who creates them? I couldn't do chromosome painting because i have the demo version of Admixture studio. Are there other calculators on Gedmatch good for inspect this trace? I've also tried Illustrativedna Admixlab but i've never managed to get a decent model, do you know what sources and references to put in as a northem-central italian? Thank you

 

[davef]

Your dad prob had some NA leftover from ancient times, prob not common but it must’ve stuck around for your dad’s side. I can’t think of any other explanation, then again I’m far as hell from an expert, maybe someone who knows about north Italy can chime in

 

[davef]

Honestly I don't see that as surprising. First because we're discussing minimal differences at the end of the day but also geographically, the northern part of Tuscany is aligned with Romagna - it is not like we're talking of Romagna and say Campania after all.

No problem! I’m not one to question someone who was born and raised in north Italy especially as someone of only partial Italian descent born in the US who never even been there. I keep learning new things about this topic and they’re pretty damn fascinating

 

[davef]

That k16 seems off. Tbh I don’t trust these calculators. They all give crazy results, which is why I never had my dna tested. It would be even crazier for me since I’m mixed! Any calculator would freak out trying to figure out a south euro, Levantine and NW euro mutt like me. Anyway I gotta rest, I’m up way too late (Thursdays into Friday I tend to stay up late for some crazy reason)